ANST - Award recommendation issues..

[Jeanne Stapleton]

Berengaria here:

> Galen of Bristol here!
> 
> Pug, I appreciate your bringing this up.
> 
This is a great discussion.  I'm going to snip some, in the interests 
of bandwidth, and comment upon a couple of the excellent points
raised by Galen and Pug:

[snippety]

> >   What is making "award recommendations"?
> > 
> >   I assume that writing a formal letter to the Crown or local
> >   Rulers about the person, which award and why is clearly one. Are
> >   there others?
> 
> Yes, of course there are.
> 
I would submit that seeking a private discussion with a landed noble
or peer and calmly laying out reasons why someone should receive
an award is making an award recommendation.

> >   Is sitting around discussing "why So-And-So is and So-And-So
> >   isn't" a form of award recommendation?
> 
> It can be.  If you have this discussion on private e-mail or chat,
> or in your own living room or around your own campfire, then no. 
> But if you do it as the topic of discussion at your barony's monthly
> meeting, or on this mailing list, both of which are essentially
> public forums, I suggest that that does constitute an award
> recommendation, and has no valid place as a topic of public
> discourse.
> 
I'd further say that there is little that is more offputting than a 
person belligerently stating that "Joe has been overlooked for
so long", or "Everyone knows that Joe should have X, and it's
obviously just political".  Once again, sitting around a campfire
could be a valid forum if people with the means to do something
about it--add the recommendation to their own letters, speak in
their peerage circle, consider the matter when they ascend the
throne in a month--are present.  But the matter should be pre-
sented as, "Now in our group, for example...Joe is always the
first person there setting up, and one of the last to leave.  I had
to take a mop out of his hands last week and tell him to go to
the after-revel and have fun.  He's been doing that for six
years.  I have high hopes of seeing him receive a ____ someday,
but I think everyone believes he already has one."  I can't count
the number of times I've been told that "Joe's been overlooked for
an AA" without being told *what* Joe's done.  When I've investigated
(which I generally do), I discover that really Joe hasn't done much
except be colorful; maybe it's really his lady who deserves the 
award, but Joe's been doing the talking big.  (And no, that isn't
something that should be on a public mailing list!  :-))

> >   Is mentioning that you think someone might be worthy in idle
> >   passing either in person or email an award recommendation? (As
> >   someone recently asked me if it was or not and I was completely
> >   shocked.)
> 
> Again, it can be.  If I say, "Gee, Lord X sure helped me out last
> weekend; he helps a lot of people," that's word-fame.  If I say,
> "Hey, why isn't Lord X a Pelican; if he's not worthy, I can't
> imagine who would be" is an award recommendation.
> 
I think both are.  :-)  It depends on where Lord X is in the scheme 
of things.  If Lord X just got an AA, maybe it's just confirming 
that he's a great guy, was deserving, and someone will look at him 
again later on down the pipe tos ee if he's still helpful and 
courteous.

[snip]

> (The following is a _completely_ ficticious example.)
> Suppose you publically bring up Lady Z and ask why she's not a peer.
> Then suppose I tell you she's not because the circle was very
> distressed that her children were taken away from her last month on
> the suspicion that she was abusing them.  So we're waiting to see
> how the trial comes out.  Did you really want to know that?  Do you
> think such things should be aired publically?
> 
I'd further add, to this unhappy situation:  suppose that the 
accusation was brought about by a vengeful ex-husband or ex-roommate,
*and it's not true*.  In most states (YMMV) Child Services is bound
to investigate any such accusations and to remove the children until
proof can be found otherwise.  Let's say it's not true.  but how much
damage would be done by word getting around that her children were
taken away because of suspiciion of abuse, and how likely is it that
word that the charges were not true would reach everyone who'd heard
the original gossip?

The negative has a much more fascinating and far-reaching impact than
the truth, sad to say, human nature being what it is.  But as Galen 
points out, the circle would be bound to wait and hope for the best,
but not make any moves until the resolution was known.

> >   I've never sat down and wrote to the Crown or the Order's circle
> >   regarding a potential candidate (since I think it would be
> >   presumptuous *especially* since I don't have a clear concept of
> >   the guidelines) but am I making recommendations by just
> >   discussing different individuals and the guidelines?
> 
> Well, Pug, I don't think your ideas of what a peer should be are so
> fuzzy.  You've consistently expressed them over quite a long period
> of time.  I know that we in the peerage circles can't be everywhere
> or see everything, and so another point of view is valuable and
> welcome. So give award-rec-writing a try sometime; if you can bring
> up a discussion in public about an individual, you could write to
> Their Majesties and tell them you don't understand why that person
> shouldn't be a peer.
> 
I know I've said it before, but I'll echo Galen again:  sit down and
write letters.  If you're concerned about "fuzziness", spell out, 
succinctly, your own criteria at the start of the letter:  "My ideals 
of what a peer should be are that he should be truthful, honorable,
courteous, and have clean fingernails.  Well, Joe has always met
and exceeded these standards in his personal behavior.  In terms of 
his service..."  And there you go.  If the Crown understands what
yardstick you're using, they're a lot more likely to understand and
appreciate why you wrote the letter.

The Crown is not omniscient.  Neither are the peers.  Another thing
that we're aware of is that we may not always be seeing the big
picture.  Somene who races around when the Crown and select
peers are present and tries to be in the thick of everything will 
probably make an impression.  We need you to tell us that she 
never does a lick of work or shows up for much of anything when
it's just the folk in the shire.  :-)

Countess Berengaria de Montfort de Carcassonne, OP
Barony of Caerthe
Kingdom of the Outlands
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