[Ansteorra] Ducal Perogative

Sir Morgan Buchanan morganbuchanan at hotmail.com
Sat Nov 10 04:38:07 PST 2007

First, Laszlo's statement about the limit of when a Duke "may" withdraw is 
inaccurate.  In fact, in this very last crown, Duke Miguel withdrew in the 
semi-finals.  I believe that some crowns have requested that people make 
their withdrawals prior to certain points in they tourney, and that of 
course is the crown's prerogative.  Further, such a  law restricting 
withdrawals in the semis or finals would circumvent SCA law that allows 
anyone to refuse any fight at any time, with the caveat that it may cause  a 

I believe that some kingdoms still have their version of ducal prerogative 
which allows a duke to ENTER a crown list after it begins.  This is usually 
done to eliminate a fighter who is viewed as "not belonging" after the fact, 
if I'm not mistaken.  Of course in those instances the Crown ALSO has the 
ability to say, "you're done" but for whatever reason in THOSE kingdoms, 
they don't do it.  I can't speculate.

Make no mistake, in kingdoms that don't have our codified prerogative, 
members of the royal family DO enter crown with the same intention as our... 
to have some influence over the list, to ensure the quality of the list. 
The only difference is that they "ducal out" by simply not blocking a shot 
at the right time.

Fighters withdraw due to injury or inability to continue all the time. 
There are plenty of mechanisms with which to withdraw and not be seen as 

So what I'm saying is that so much of this is a very semantic argument.  We 
just codify something to display it as an honor (This Duke believes so 
strongly in me that he withdraws because he'd bend a knee to me as his 
prince and crown) instead of forcing subterfuge.

Just my thoughts.

Kind regards,

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "robert segrest" <aumbob at yahoo.com>

> As far as technical issues, I believe that the difference between a duke's 
> perogative and an ordinary fighters ability to withdraw during a list is 
> not entirely based on honor.  A duke may fight a round, soundly trounce 
> his opponent and then 'ducal out' allowing said opponent to proceed.  I 
> believe that an ordinary fighter who withdrew after winning a round would 
> simply be removed from the next round, without providing any benefit to 
> the defeated opponent.
> It is also my understanding that nobody, including dukes, may withdraw in 
> the semi-final and final rounds.  So whatever influence the dukes may be 
> able to exert is somewhat limited when it becomes most important.  Any 
> successful aspirant to the crown will have to defeat at least two 
> opponents after all ducal perogatives have been exercised.
> I would love to hear from some of our older fighters/marshalls who may 
> know more about the history and thinking that led to this unusual custom.
> Lord Fatthiopap Laszlo

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