[Ansteorra] WHITE SCARF QUESTION

[Cisco Cividanes]

Indeed,
Good Master Robin has clarified the flaw in my a statement with
exceptional clarity.

Thank you.
Ivo


On Mon, Oct 19, 2009 at 10:56 PM, Jay Rudin <rudin at peoplepc.com> wrote:
> Ivo wrote:
>
>>no, you would not address someone as "cadet so and so", just like you
>>would not use the titles Protege, squire or Apprentice before a
>>persons name.
>
> Actually, lots of people do refer to "cadet <name>, or "squire <name>".  It's incorrect, but they do so anyway.  Very few non-heralds are as precise about correct heraldic usage as the heralds are.
>
>>I have, however called a great many people onto the list as "Lord so
>>and so, Cadet to Don..." or "His Lordship, Squire to Sir..." These are
>>commonly used, and are well accepted.
>
> They are commonly used and well accepted, but they are still not titles.  It is not a "title" unless one is legally entitled to it.  "Don" is a title, in part because I have a legal claim to be called that.  But my cadets are simply people I choose to be associated with.
>
> "Don" or "Master" are titles.  I am entitled to them, and the Crown cannot remove them without a formal appeal for a change in my legal status through the board.  I also have the academic title of "Dr. Rudin".  I'm entitled to it, and nobody can remove it.  But I could tell one of my cadets that he or she is not a cadet any more, and he or she wouldn't be.  They have no entitlement to it -- it's a relationship, not a title.
>
> (Note that in a military academy, "cadet" is a rank.  The cadet cannot lose that position without a hearing to take it away.  He is entitled to it.]
>
>>None of the student titles or insignia is officially recognized or
>>protected as I recall, however each one represented a formal
>>relationship between a teacher and student, and part of that
>>relationship is public recognition.
>
> All of this is true, and none of it changes the definition of the word "title".  Corpora defines the titles used in the SCA in section VIII.D.2., and then contrasts that with "Names and terms that imply relationships between Society members (such as apprentice, page, squire, etc.)" in section VIII.D.3.
>
> Robin of Gilwell / Jay Rudin
>
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