[Ansteorra] Nitpicking Angry Folks (WAS: Indoor Fighting)

[Teresa Herring]

Replied Privately--


-----Original Message-----
From: ansteorra-bounces+kelandra_c=sbcglobal.net at lists.ansteorra.org
[mailto:ansteorra-bounces+kelandra_c=sbcglobal.net at lists.ansteorra.org] On
Behalf Of Rose
Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2010 8:35 PM
To: Inc.Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] Nitpicking Angry Folks (WAS: Indoor Fighting)

You said: If you don't mean to use a word that has negative connotations,
then don't use it. 

As I explained, I did mean to use the word 'macho' with the exact definition
that appears in credible dictionaries and I understand that it has negative
connotations. Some people claimed that it was insulting and untrue. I
disagree. So does the dictionary. Nevertheless, I stand by my use of the
word.

 You said: You don't get to "suggest" we shut up and go away after the
kerfuffle has started.  Sorry.

I can suggest anything that I like. You are welcome to not take that
suggestion.

You said: No, but it's part and parcel of a societal definition of "macho."

I disagree.

You said: Again, if it's not what you meant, why did you use the word?  Why
did you not find a more precise way to express yourself, rather than use an
imprecise word and then wonder why some folx took issue with it?

I didn't use the wrong word, and I didn't use an imprecise word. I used the
word with the exact meaning that I wanted to use. The only other meaning?
>From the Urban Dictionary.

The Urban Dictionary is hardly a credible source for the American language.
If it is an accurate dictionary, then you should be very careful calling
people by their given names. By calling me 'Rose', you could be flirting
with me or soliciting money for sex from me. 

And I had better not call you 'Helene' because that's a 'dysfunction
succubus that devours all it touches, its voracious
appetite rarely fulfilled. A dangerously evil creation encased and
contained within the supple skin of a woman'. Yikes. That's way worse than
the Urban Dictionary definition of 'macho'.

To be clear, I don't think that you're some sort of succubus. I do think
that the Urban Dictionary is a joke, and I'm not going to vet my words
through it before I speak. If the listener doesn't have the good sense to
use a better dictionary, then they deserve to feel offended by what they
find there. Do you disagree?

You said: Wow, if that's the description you wanted to give, then that's
what you should have written.  Again, words have meaning, especially in
written form when nonverbal cues are lost.  If you choose to use a word
KNOWING it has negative connotations, then why are you surprised when people
react negatively to it?

It /is/ what I wrote. And yes, this word has a meaning, and that meaning has
a negative connotation. That's exactly the word I wanted to use, and those
connotations were the ones that I wanted to express. The only surprise lies
in an attempt to change my words by using a source as inane as the Urban
Dictionary.

You said: Then perhaps you should also consider that using inflammatory
words, especially in the course of  nitpicking at people for their
"machobone going 'ting'," might not be the best idea.

I've already apologized to those who felt offended by the use of that word,
especially if they thought that I was using the 'definition' put forth by
the Urban Dictionary. Regardless, it is the correct word, by a credible
dictionary, and I stand by it. In other words, I'm sorry that it makes you
feel bad, but that's my opinion of the situation.

Also, I wasn't nitpicking people for their 'macho bone'. It was a joke, and
a pretty good one, since many Ansteorran fighters do have a macho bone. You
may not like it, but it's the truth. I mean, what's more macho than
honorably beating up other folks with sticks?

You said: Also, as a woman, I dislike being called macho.  I'm not.  I'm
strong,
confident, smart and probably bitchy, but not macho.  So, I'll take
offense at the word being applied to me, other female fighters may or
may not.  It's up to*them* to decide if they find insult in the word,
not me, and not you.

Heavy fighting is not gender-neutral. Most Ansteorrans fighters are male,
and heavy fighting is seen as a manly thing to do. That means that heavy
fighters are being masculine, by today's standards and especially by the
standards of the Middle Ages, regardless of their gender. Don't like it?
Encourage more women to fight, until there are so many women in armor that
heavy fighting is as gender-neutral as painting. That would rock.

Also, do you get het up when people make the heavy fighters vs. light
fighter jokes, the jokes about lack of brain cells, and so on? I hear them
rather frequently, so I had no reason to believe that heavy fighters would
be offended by my joke. (The ones in the room with me certainly were not.)
If not, then why are you so offended by a joke with the same flavor?

You said: Titles are a recognition of who and what we are in the Society.

Yes, and if people choose not to use them, who am I to argue? I didn't say
that titles were worthless, or unimportant. I said that it makes the most
sense to use the name that people give you, and presumptuous to be offended
if I don't take the time go to a different site, look up someone's name, and
magically know which title that they prefer. I stand by both of those
statements. Do you disagree with either of them?

You said: Robin's wife has not insulted you.

Robin's wife rather venomously insulted me, repeatedly. Just because you
didn't see it, doesn't mean that it didn't happen.

You said: The wife Ioannes mentioned you insulting?  That would be me, which
is why he used the phrase "my wife."

Ah, then he is going to take exception to your rudeness as well? No? That
sort of takes the brunt out of his claim, then. I'm reasonably sure that the
only offense that you're claiming that I've given is calling fighters
'macho'. It is my firm opinion that most fighters are macho. If you want to
take offense at that, so be it. Did I offend you in some other way? If so,
please let me know.

I'm always willing to speak with people on almost any topic, especially when
we disagree. I think you learn more when you speak to people who disagree
with you. :P Of course, that's fairly easy for me, because I don't generally
get angry when people disagree with me, and when others get angry, I don't
usually take it personally. :)


-Rose the Obnoxious
_______________________________________________
Ansteorra mailing list
Ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
In order to make changes and manage your account please go to:
http://lists.ansteorra.org/listinfo.cgi/ansteorra-ansteorra.org