[Ansteorra] Royalty - Same Sex Consorts‏

David Brown lddevin03 at yahoo.com
Sun Oct 30 07:29:58 PDT 2011


That is how you see it Robin. That is not the view of others however. A King or Queen can rule on their own. If we have 2 Kings or 2 Queens then there should be no less of a royal presence. So what if this is about gay people? Gay people have been around forever. This is about creating a game where everyone is welcome. 

You totally missed the point of non period items being allowed in to an event. What we do is not real. These are not the middle ages and we do not fight to see who will be king.
This whole discussion, in my opinion, has gone on way too long. If 2 people of the same sex want to run for a crown, let them. What will it hurt? Will it hurt how you play the SCA? It hurts me every time I see someone walk by in garb with tennis shoes...but you do not see me throwing a fit?

We live in modern times and what we are creating is modern middle ages. In these modern times there are same sex couples (there always have been). Do we just shut the gate and say that they are not welcome? If we do that then we do we start restricting the color of skin that a Crown can be? 

To that we all say no, but to same sex you would say yes. Is that fair?

I will follow my own heart and my own advice and I will not comment anymore on this topic. I believe that those in power will do what is right and that the group (SCA) as a whole will be all right.

Lord Devin


________________________________
From: Jay Rudin <rudin at peoplepc.com>
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA,Inc." <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Sent: Sunday, October 30, 2011 8:56 AM
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] Royalty - Same Sex Consorts‏


>If 2 men (lovers or not) or 2 women (lovers or not) want to fight in a Crown tourney...why not!

Consider two situations:

Situation A - A person wants to carry the favor of the person who inspires him. Should he be allowed to do so? I think virtually all reasonable people would say "Yes."

Situation B: A married couple have spent the last year as the seneschal and herald of a barony. They have found it convenient having these two high-paperwork offices in the same house, and so they are both stepping down together. Another couple want to do the same thing, and have applied to be replacement officers, which they want to do together. However, they are both heralds, and they are asking the barony to have two heralds and no seneschal for the next two years. Should they be allowed to do so? I think everyone who understands the SCA structure will say "No".

So the question is this - is a same-sex consort in Crown tourney more like situation A or Situation B?

And the unhelpful answer is that it is 100% like Situation A to some people, and 100% like situation B to other people. 

Specifically, there are many SCA members whose personas and entire approach to the SCA is based on their relationship to their king, or their queen.

The persona, goals,ideals, and activities of Robin of Gilwell, Elizabethan noble and Ansteorran Don, are focused on my relationship to the Queen. If there is no queen, then there can be no Robin.

Rose wrote "This is not about gay people.". If only that were true. In that case, this would be an easy choice. Crown tourney exists to provide us the roles of King and Queen, and the roles of Sovereign and Consort.

When Rowan was Queen, it was pretty easy to figure out what were the duties of King, Queen, Sovereign and Consort. They were bundled differently, but each role existed, for the good of the kingdom.

Many people have the hazy idea that a primary purpose for a Consort is to provide sex for the Sovereign. This is not true, either in our history or in our rules. While the majority of royal couples have been lovers, many have not, including the current king and queen of Ansteorra.

We've always denied some people the right to fight for their lovers in Crown, and always will. Many fighters have had to fight for somebody other than their lover, because the lover was not qualified, or overseas, or merely unwilling to be take part in the SCA.

I have fought in many tourneys carrying somebody else's favor. But even so, even if the prize I win goes to another, Serena will always be my primary inspiration.

Nonetheless, I have fought several times in Crown, and always for my lover. Gay fighters, reasonably enough, want the same.

It's clear that a barony cannot have two heralds and no seneschal. It is less clear to many people whether a kingdom can have two kings and no queen, or two queens and no king.

I don't want to deny people the chance to fight for their lovers, but the fact remains - Robin of Gilwell, as he has been established for over thirty years, cannot exist without a Queen.

Robin of Gilwell / Jay Rudin

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