ARCH - Interesting
Mike Catron
meggiddo at netzero.net
Mon Feb 5 20:09:00 PST 2001
I am using golf tubes when I travel out of kingdom. I had to use them at
Lillies War this past June. And I will be using golf tubes at Estrella
War next week. The bow used was 40 lbs. while facing 50 lb bows at
Lillies and I had to borrow that one otherwise would have to take the
field with my 30 lb bow. I have thought of using them here within
Ansteorra as a warm-up prior to traveling to out of kingdom war events.
Eadric Anstapa wrote:
> Actually the Society max for combat crossbows according to the Current
> Missile Combat Rules (available via the web pages) is 1000 inch-pounds for
> Golf-tube arrows and 600 inch-pounds for fiberglass or wood shafted arrows.
>
> I dunno about the 40# thing for golf-tube bows. I have for a long time
> thought that was interesting. Is anyone in this kingdom using Golf-tube
> arrows? As siege weapons/ballista are becoming more common it seems like it
> might be prudent not to allow the use of golftubes with bows and instead
> just restrict them to siege weapons to avoids confusion.
>
> -Eadric
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bob Dewart" <gilli at seacove.net>
> To: <ansteorra-archery at ansteorra.org>
> Sent: Monday, February 05, 2001 9:55 PM
> Subject: Re: ARCH - Interesting
>
>
>> I've always wondered about that 40 vs 50lb thing. Why did we shoot
>
> ourselves
>
>> in the foot on that on so to speak? I know there aren't very many folks
>> around that use golf tube arrows, but still. If you go some where else
>
> that
>
>> uses them, you're at a big disadvantage because your equipment is 20%
>
> weaker
>
>> from the start.
>>
>> Also, if I'm not mistaken, isn't the Society max for combat crossbows
>> 650inch pounds? So why is ours 600? Or do we just like spotting everyone
>> else 50inch pounds?
>>
>> Great catch on the footpounds. I guess some times it's the forest for the
>> trees type of thing.
>>
>> Gilli
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Eadric Anstapa" <eadric at barley.scabrewer.com>
>> To: <ansteorra-archery at ansteorra.org>
>> Sent: Monday, February 05, 2001 9:11 PM
>> Subject: Re: ARCH - Interesting
>>
>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Harry C. Billings" <psobaka at mail.myriad.net>
>>>
>>>> IIRC SCA rules take president over Kingdom rules. IOW you measure from
>>>
>> the
>>
>>>> riser back to get your 28 inches. If our arrows are 28 inches from the
>>>> bottom of the knock to the base of the head and our marshals know how
>>>
> to
>
>>> and
>>>
>>>> check bows for draw weight as well as check arrows this is not a
>>>
>> problem,
>>
>>>> but should be corrected as expidently as possible.
>>>
>>> Doesn't really apply here. The MINIMUM standards are set by the
>>
> Society.
>
>>> Individual Kingdoms are entitled to me more strict. The way it is
>>
> worded
>
>>> now, although weird and wrong, is actually more restrictive and limiting
>>
>> on
>>
>>> the weight of bow than is the Society standards.
>>>
>>> I really like the way the society standards are written. It is
>>
> extremely
>
>>> clear how draw length/weight should be measured (28" from center of
>>
> riser)
>
>>> and how arrow length is to be measured (28" from just behind head/blunt
>>
> to
>
>>> bottom of slot in nock).
>>>
>>> These are two separate measurements. The length of arrow is limited so
>>
>> that
>>
>>> people can not over-draw and get more weight/force/thrust out of their
>>
> bow
>
>>> and draw length definition is so that there is a clear measurement for
>>> checking the 30# or 40# bows. Yep that's right folks the SCA standard
>>
> for
>
>>> Heavy/Golf-tube bows is 50#, the Ansteorran limit is 40#.
>>>
>>> In reading the Ansteorran Complete Participants Handbook more carefully
>>
>> and
>>
>>> looking for similar mistakes (Since Gilli brought it up) I see that it
>>
> is
>
>>> worse than I could imagine.
>>>
>>> Section 6, subsection II. Paragraph A., Subparagraph 2a says:
>>>
>>> a. Have a maximum strength of thirty (30) foot pounds at 28" draw using
>>> legal wooden or
>>> fiberglass shafted quarrels.
>>>
>>> NOTICE is says 30 FOOT pounds. That is way different than simple
>>
> pounds.
>
>>> Since 28" is 2.33 feet that means that According to the Complete
>>> Participants Handbook using this statement and the also included
>>
>> definition
>>
>>> of "draw" the maximum draw weight for a bow is Ansteorra as
>>
> traditionally
>
>>> measured by modern and AMO standards will be 12.86 pounds.
>>>
>>> It seems clear that whoever wrote this was mixing Crossbow and Handbow
>>> standards without success. The draw length for a crossbow is measured
>>
>> from
>>
>>> the string at rest (not the bow/prod) to the nut (they call this the
>>> power-stroke of the bow) and the maximum draw weight for crossbows is
>>> expressed in Inch-pounds.
>>>
>>> What is more strange is that I know that there are many marshals out
>>
>> there,
>>
>>> myself included, who have read these rules a number of times. Why have
>>
> we
>
>>> not noticed these mistakes before? I guess when you are an experienced
>>> marshal and you read these it is easy to read what you know rather than
>>
>> what
>>
>>> is actually there.
>>>
>>> Regards.
>>>
>>> Eadric
>>
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