[Ansteorra-archery] Comments about Archers at Gulf War XI

Wed Mar 20 13:39:17 PST 2002

Just on the few people I know with King's Archers I'd have to say it's like a Pine Cone.  The Fire explodes the cone spreading seeds everywhere but then it takes a good dose of Fertilizer to get it to grow.

Ld. Fathead, Esq., KAA, Fertilizer salesman

---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Dewart, Charles R. --G3 Contractor (Anteon Corp)"
Reply-To: ansteorra-archery at ansteorra.org
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2002 15:21:47 -0600

>That's how those blazes get started.  Some folks can't stand to get beaten.
>And when it happens, they become driven to see it doesn't happen again.
>Sometimes it takes, what seems like, a terriblly long time to do this.
>
>I know.
>
>In 1989 I noticed that Ansteorra didn't even have a score in the IKCAC.
>Hard to imagime that now, isn't it? So I started doing the competition here.
>It's been a long rode and there still aren't many that travel it with me.
>But we have in the last 6 years took first place 3 times, last two back to
>back.
>
>I hope that they all get the fire in them.  I'd love to see them so fired
>up, that they all find where the King's Archers grow.
>
>Gilli
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: ironwyrm at juno.com [mailto:ironwyrm at juno.com]
>Sent: Wednesday, March 20, 2002 2:24 PM
>To: ansteorra-archery at ansteorra.org
>Subject: Re: [Ansteorra-archery] Comments about Archers at Gulf War XI
>
>
>Quite the contrary good Lord Gilli, if anything it has given the combat
>archers from my own household a goal for next year.  Many of which have
>already contacted me wanting to know what was done wrong, what to do to
>improve, and when they could get back into armor to fight again (which
>will be at Elfsea's Springfaire).
>
>"That which does not kill us makes us stronger!"  We drummed them in the
>archers' only battles last year.  They did us this year, we have a year
>to plan our revenge.  That's the great thing about Gulf, it's never
>really over, and we'll return next year wiser and stronger.
>
>Ironwyrm
>
>
>On Wed, 20 Mar 2002 13:30:32 -0600 "Dewart, Charles R. --G3 Contractor
>(Anteon Corp)" <Charles.Dewart at hood.army.mil> writes:
>> I think our main problem with the combat archers in this Kingdom, and
>> I'm
>> not quite sure how to put it without ticing someone off (which I
>> seem to be
>> good at), is a lack of commitment and desire on the whole.  Now by
>> that I
>> mean instead of a blazing fire in their gut, most have a candle.
>> Granted,
>> we do have some who have a blaze in them.  But most are recreational
>> archers.  The same is true on the target side of the house.
>>
>> Is not having a burning desire for archery a bad thing?  NO!  But it
>> can be
>> most frustrating for those who do.
>>
>> What can we do about it?  Other than just what we've been doing, I
>> don't
>> know.  We just keep plugging away at it.  However, getting everyone
>> to agree
>> on how we should be pluggin' away is most difficult also.
>>
>> I'm confident that the Arcus Majoris will help in this.  It will
>> show a
>> possible goal for their efforts.  Ofcourse, it will take a few years
>> for
>> that to happen.
>>
>> Some of us are better at one part of archery than others; and that's
>> OK.
>> Some of us are just starting out, cool.  Some of us will never be
>> really
>> serious about any of it, but enjoy what they do; that's great too.
>>
>> We all do what we do given the factors of our lives.
>>
>> They may have beat us in the Archers only battle.  But we smoke'em
>> in the
>> IKCA and IKCAC plus we took the archery war point.  :)
>>
>> Gilli
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Mike Catron [mailto:meggiddo at netzero.net]
>> Sent: Wednesday, March 20, 2002 7:12 AM
>> To: ansteorra-archery
>> Subject: [Ansteorra-archery] Comments about Archers at Gulf War XI
>>
>>
>> Greetings.
>>
>> The below is a sub-section of an earlier e-mail that I sent out
>> titled
>> Combat Archer Report on Gulf Wars XI.
>>
>> I have come to realize over time that the best way to deal with
>> various
>> comments is listen first to how, when, and where the individual
>> makes
>> those comments. I will usual speak up and engage that individual or
>> individuals in open discussion.
>>
>> The majority of the time - these individual welcome open and honest
>> discussion. In fact, they will often ask questions and bring out
>> some
>> false information that they have been told about combat archers.
>>
>> Yes, to stand in the middle of a group of heavy fighters all by
>> yourself
>> and ID oneself as a combat archer does take abit of courage. Yet, I
>> have
>> found if one does so, then there is respect coming back from those
>> fighters. And they would more than likely will listen.
>>
>> The key is recognize how the comment is being made and where.
>>
>> I strongly suggest that each archer who are combat archers or wishes
>> to
>> become combat archers to a very simple thing.
>>
>> Take one weekend off a month from shooting "static" archery and
>> instead
>> go to your local fighter's practice. If possible, actual practice
>> with
>> the fighters. If not, at least introduce yourself as a combat
>> archer.
>> Yes, there will be some who make comments. I went through the same
>> thing
>> two years ago. But you know what, over time with showing up and
>> asking
>> questions of the fighters and more importantly listening to them on
>> how
>> they fight, would gave you a better insight in how combat within the
>> SCA
>> is really conduct. I have found that this help in my surviving
>> longer on
>> at Gulf Wars XI.
>>
>> Comments that I heard at Gulf Wars XI:
>>
>> Comments about archers in the shower trailer -
>> I was in the back of the trailer when someone came in and
>> asked if there was any archers present. I respond back that I was
>> one,
>> but he was in the common room and like I said I was in the back,
>> thus
>> could not hear me. Completed my business and walked into the common
>> room.
>>
>> There were roughly 6 fighters present there and I walked in
>> there and I ID myself as an archer. The discussion started between a
>> knight (found this out afterwards and myself). Within 2 minutes all
>> others present became quiet. The same issue - Touch Kill or White
>> Diamonds - archers who can reach with a "30 foot spear" hit a
>> fighter,
>> BUT that fighter or another can not hit back. In other words,
>> special
>> rules for the archers to play!
>>
>> Fighters take 5 or 10 or 15 years to get to the level of where
>> they a force on the field. An archer can reduce all that effort to
>> nothing by just picking a bow and a combat arrow and practicing for
>> a
>> couple of weeks prior to going on the battlefield. This is even less
>> for
>> a crossbow, which was proven last year at Gulf War X.
>>
>> I could have very easy became a White Diamond, but DID NOT!
>> Instead I became a heavy contact archer - I have been hit by
>> fighters.
>> And I feel that is only fair. I can hit them and they can hit me. It
>> is
>> a level playing field between the fighters that I shoot at and me.
>>
>> The Touch Kill rule was put in place to cut down on confusion
>> as to whether the archer that fighter(s) are about to remove from
>> the
>> field is a heavy contact or a White Diamond.
>>
>> I have stated that Touch Kill sucks! I have gone so far as to
>> place this in writing to various Marshals here in Ansteorra by
>> e-mail.
>>
>> I do NOT want special rules for me as a combat archer to join
>> with the heavy fighters and play this game that belongs to all of
>> us.
>> This does not bring the two groups together, but actually drive the
>> camps further apart.
>>
>> Before the Touch Kill rule came into effect, if an archer gets to
>> close to the shield wall and it broke. A fighter coming through it,
>> has
>> been struck several times and he or she has managed to get pass
>> the shields, they are swing at anything that moves with a helm on.
>> The
>> archer is too close to that wall - fighter sees another helm and by
>> training and instinct - swings and hit the archer. Only afterwards,
>> they
>> realized that the individual was an archer.
>>
>> And that archer then cries out that the fighter hit them with
>> more force than necessary.
>>
>> If on the other hand the archer is in open field and the fighter
>> runs up and strikes with more force than necessary... Then I agree
>> the
>> archer has a reason to cry foul!
>>
>> It also does not help when a White Diamond or two states that
>> they were dead (10 foot rule when a fighter comes within that
>> distance),
>> starts to walk off the field. Only to see that White Diamond turn
>> around
>> and shoot that same fighter or another of his group.
>>
>> So which or what is the correct solution - I can not say, since
>> there are blame on both sides of this.
>>
>> The outcome of between the knight and myself - we exchange
>> names and shook hands. He is Sir Sherdian (I do hope I spelled this
>> correct) from Caltinor. I did enjoy the discussion between the two
>> of us
>> and I hope he did too.
>>
>> Elsewhere during the battles - there were a number of comments made
>> about archers. Such as:
>>
>> "I hate archers." This from a fighter as he came off the field after
>> being "kill" by an archer, with no chance to fight whatsoever.
>>
>> "We do not allow archers to play with us at home."
>>
>> "Damm archers - they hit me, but all I can do is touch them. If
>> they want to play then they should play by the same rules as we do
>> (fighters)."
>>
>> "I love archers." When the archer is on their side and just shot
>> another archer or pole or knight or etc...
>>
>> I do work with a heavy shield wall unit at their practice. And no, I
>> do
>> not shoot "static" archery. I just wish to do combat archery and
>> that is
>> what I train to do year around.
>>
>> Michael of the Fray
>>
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