[Ansteorra-archery] Horsebow vs. Longbow

Harry Billings humble_archer at hotmail.com
Thu May 30 12:44:59 PDT 2013


from the fiberglass "long" bows that I have seen most have built out handles and there for are NOT period regardless of material.

plachoya 

Ansteorra


Date: Thu, 30 May 2013 13:20:40 -0500
From: doug.copley at gmail.com
To: ansteorra-archery at lists.ansteorra.org
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra-archery] Horsebow vs. Longbow

Kool, just making sure. Thanks for your help. It looks like several recommendations are going to go forward to the keeper of the IKAC for recommended rule changes and since we are basing the Royal Round off of those they will be the same.

The change would allow horsebows with fiberglass limbs that are covered to be allowed as Period Handbows. Longbows made from fiberglass would still be in the Open Handbow Division. I am also asking why simple range markings on Period Longbow limbs are not allowed when ample evidence shows that they were used.

Vincenti

On Thu, May 30, 2013 at 1:12 PM, Ld. Cian Rhys Gravenor <metaldog00 at hotmail.com> wrote:

I agree with you we need clarification of the rules. I thought that's what we were trying to do by discussing it.  I wasn't arguing against it. I was arguing for the simplest solution. 

Cian

Sent from my iPhone
On May 30, 2013, at 12:35 PM, "Doug Copley" <doug.copley at gmail.com> wrote:


easier to get people to do it when the rules are clear and concise. Not sure why there is a resistance to getting a clarification on the rules and having everyone use the same guidelines? 


Vincenti

On Thu, May 30, 2013 at 12:27 PM, Ld. Cian Rhys Gravenor <metaldog00 at hotmail.com> wrote:


Kist out of curiosity, is there even enough people turning in period IKAC or RR scores to even be concerned about this? If not then maybe we need to be more lenient on the matter. 


Cian

Sent from my iPhone
On May 30, 2013, at 12:18 PM, "samcupps1259 at yahoo.com" <samcupps1259 at yahoo.com> wrote:



Well, if you consider the cross bow rules it says the prod can be of any material. A glass prod is faster than a steel one but we allow that. I think we can all agree that it is abundantly clear  that the big concern is the center cut risers not the materials the bow is made of.


HL Samuel ap Dewi



Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE Smartphone 




-------- Original message --------
From: Doug Copley <doug.copley at gmail.com> 
Date: 05/30/2013  11:55 AM  (GMT-06:00) 
To: Archery within the Kingdom of Ansteorra <ansteorra-archery at lists.ansteorra.org> 


Subject: Re: [Ansteorra-archery] Horsebow vs. Longbow 
 

Rules have been posted on this, the problem is they are subject to interpretation.
You can go to: http://www.scores-sca.org/public/scores_rules.php?R=10&Shoot=65



There are 2 sentences that cause problems. one says you can use modern materials the other says you can't gain an unfair advantage. If you use fiberglass and it shoots faster you are gaining an unfair advantage. Also if you are using fiberglass and all it says is to cover it, then why not get an all fiberglass bow and cover it and use it?



Vincenti

On Thu, May 30, 2013 at 11:26 AM, Ld. Cian Rhys Gravenor <metaldog00 at hotmail.com> wrote:



It was my understanding of the IKAC rules what the bow is made of doesn't matter so long as the bow has no center cut in it. I am unable to confirm that due to the fact I can't seem to get to the IKAC rules for some reason. I don't suppose you could post the relevant portion of those rules, could you?



Cian

Sent from my iPhone
On May 30, 2013, at 9:12 AM, "Doug Copley" <doug.copley at gmail.com> wrote:




This question was in regards to Period Shooting and Scoring for IKAC and Royal Rounds and for Period shoots. For open shoots I would allow them no problem. I also tell people that I allow carbon and aluminum arrows to be shot, just not to be scored or to compete for a title.




Vincenti

On Thu, May 30, 2013 at 9:02 AM, Erwin Simmons <ESIMMONS001 at hot.rr.com> wrote:





  
    
  
  
    Are you asking for "period" shoots or
      for all shoots?  For regular shoots most bows are allowed as long
      as they have no stabilizers and or sighting devices.  I would not
      allow any of the really newer bow with the magnesium risers etc. 
      I have seen modern longbows, ie. laminated wood and fiberglass
      limbs allowed for "period" shooting.

      A period Magyar or Mongol  horsebow , due to its laminated layered
      construction would have

      a distinct advantage over a standard longbow, the longbow being a
      self bow.  The horsebow was fatster and had better cast.  So for
      me I would allow it.  I am not currently an archery marshal in
      Ansteorra, however I was Lieutenant General of archers for the
      Principality of Drachenwald and I allowed the horsebows. 
      Cosmetically they look more period also than some bows being shot.

      That's my take on the question.

      

      Ld Eric Bentbow

      

      

      On 5/30/2013 7:30 AM, Doug Copley wrote:

    
    
      This brings up a good question: Modern Horse Bows.
        Wooden riser, no cut out arrow rest, limbs are covered with
        leather, BUT the limbs are fiberglass. Are they allowed?
        

        
        I have not been allowing them because with the limbs being
          fiberglass they are gaining an unfair advantage over a longbow
          made of wood. a 50# fiberglass bow will shoot fast than a 50#
          wood limb bow.
        

        
        So how is this handled in other kingdoms? I would prefer
          that we move together and try to get the rules so that they
          are the same.
        

        
        Vincenti
        Ansteorra
      
      
        

        

        On Thu, May 30, 2013 at 6:42 AM, Chuck
          Kaun <jack_a_lope31 at hotmail.com>
          wrote:

          
            OK,

            

            I believe its the symbol that you want, who really cares how
            or where you wear it?  Too hot?  Tabard is out.  Sash would
            be hot too.  Dont wear a belt?  Tie it around your arm.  You
            are shooting too and it would be in your way?  Tie it around
            your leg.  Wear a dress or a tunic?  Make a cool headband
            that goes around your hat.  Dont wear a hat?  Wear it around
            your noggin, congratulations you are now a pirate.  Dont
            want that?  OK....obviously you didnt want to wear
            one...moving on.

            

            Simply put there are many many ways to wear this thing, you
            have 5 parts of your body to attach it to aside from your
            torso that doesnt involve a lot of cloth making you overheat
            or overtly modifying your persona.  Find one and put it
            there.

            

            Now...to make it obvious...Black with a big ole yellow
            arrowhead works quite well if you are wearing light colors.
             wearing darks?  Yellow with a big ole black arrowhead on
            it.  Just dont wear it to court and the heralds wont even
            ask what the heck that thing is.

            

            The point of all of this?  a plain black or yellow scarf
            with a big ole arrowhead of the opposite color on it.  Easy
            to make, goes darn near anywhere you need it to.  Tie it to
            your bow when its time to leave so you dont lose it.

            

            Simple, easy to make, inexpensive

            

            Enjoy,

            

            Karl Thorgeirsson

            

            

            _______________________

            > From: doug.copley at gmail.com

            > To: ansteorra-archery at lists.ansteorra.org

            > Subject: Re: [Ansteorra-archery] Marshal Sash Idea

            >

            > Belt flags do not always work since many people do not
            wear a belt. All

            > of the options have some problems with them. Some
            people want them some

            > do not. Each of the options can either be hot or lost
            or forgotten. So

            > the overall idea may or may not be a good work, but I
            still see no

            > reason not to try it:-)

            >

            > I do see it being more beneficial at a LARGE event than
            at a small one.

            > At a small one, everyone knows everyone and if anyone
            walks up that is

            > not known, everyone knows it and should immediately
            step in to help

            > out.

            >

            > On the larger ones, It could be a good idea to have a
            sash or something

            > that is visible from a distance so that others can
            point you out to

            > people. Something like this would be good at Gulf Wars
            or maybe a Grand

            > Assembly of Archers, which we are hoping to have again
            next year!

            >

            > Vincenti

            g

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