AD - Guild levels...

Pug Bainter pug at
Thu Apr 1 10:32:05 PST 1999

Russell Kinder (russmax at said something that sounded like:
> The clerical position
> can be of any level within the guild, but the leadership position should
> be of Magister rank. Is that it?

This was the general idea.

>    Sounds reasonable enough. I'm not sure how much of a burden it would
> be to maintain the membership roster.

I know in the begining it will be trivial, however after a couple years
it hopefully will no longer be trivial.

In our Barony alone there are about 20 people who dance off and on
throughout the year. Of these, there are probably a half-dozen that
could already be above the interested in dance level. I know that our
dance guild is much smaller than many guilds.

> The secretarial position could be held by the same
> person indefinitely, but the leadership position ought to rotate around
> after each Kingdom Dance, I think.

Sounds very reasonable.

> If they wanted to be a branch of our guild, that would
> be OK, too, but I think the impetus for that would have to come from the
> M.E. dancers.

This is the type of idea I had in mind *if* the desire should arise.

> For some of the more complicated dances, or
> seldom danced ones, I feel there is no shame is checking the book to
> make sure one's memory is not in error.

No shame at all.

> Also, I hate to get too
> legalistic. Even if one teaches a dance from a book, by the end of
> teaching it, the teacher knows the dance.

It depends on how you define teaching in my opinion. I know we've had
dance practices where a dance was only taught once and never again.

In the real aspect of teaching, you are correct since the person would
have do it over and over at home and in their mind before they actually

Mostly it was something to think about for the criteria.

> At the Journeyman and Magister levels, the additional requirements
> pretty well ensure that one has been dancing for awhile before attaining
> those levels.

This is probably true. Particularly the choreography or research.

> The Journeyman must have been in charge of dancing at 3
> events. That means organizing the ball, working with the musicians,
> doing the walkthroughs and calling, and maybe running pre-ball classes.
> The Magister adds 3 more events and has to have some familiarity with
> original sources, as evidenced by reconstructions.

Unfortunately I didn't keep the original note, but I seem to remember it
being worded as 3 balls or dance practices. The ability to just do it at
dance practice is very good for smaller groups, but means that there
could be descripancies.

>    Yes. Let me emphasize that all levels of membership should have the
> same vote and the same right to have a say in the guild's activities.

I wasn't even gonna ask about that. *grin*

>    That's a good point. This isn't explicitly written in the charter,
> but the implication of a title like Journeyman, is that one is qualified
> to go out and do it on his own.

I think that is a much better way of wording it.

> At Magister level, one should be more
> than qualified. By "qualified", I mean that the person knows enough
> about dance to start teaching on their own. 

Very true.

>    They may not know enough about the other aspects of starting and
> running a guild, however. One must generate and sustain interest in the
> guild, recruit, plan activities, work with the local A&S minister, etc.

These are the hard parts of doing a guild actually. Many people give up
way too soon because of what they see as a lack of interest. The good
part about dance as a guild is the ability to easily plan what the activies
will be. Other guilds are not as easy.

> One must deal with beginning and advanced dancers at the same time. One
> must guard against be cliquish or exclusive. Etc, etc.

These are the more interesting parts of it.

> I'm very interested in what you have to say about guilds, in general.

I'll be teaching the class as well as writting up an article that I'm
gonna submit to the TI. We'll just have to see how off base I am from
other locales perspectives.

> I will certainly be at King's College (heh heh.)

As will I. I already sent in the classes I'd like to teach.


Phelim "Pug" Gervase  | "I want to be called. COTTONTIPS. There is something 
Barony of Bryn Gwlad  |  graceful about that lady. A young woman bursting with 
House Flaming Dog     |  vigor. She blinked at the sudden light. She writes
pug at           |  beautiful poems. When ever shall we meet again?"
  Note: The views do not reflect the SCA nor the Kingdom of Ansteorra.
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