[Bordermarch] farenheit 9/11

[kandace harris]

Well said Buddy,Well said...Our young people have a good grasp on things these days...I think alot more than we did at that age ....It has been a good debate ...even though I didn't mean to start one .....I have not seen the movie ...and... The only person I know is my friend that NEVER thinks in "poltics"....I'm not sure that other have seen it either ...I wasn't going to pay $$$ for "Moore's-Mouth" because I don't always agree with Him.(but I do defined his right to say it)....but I think I will now...that way I'll know more than what I do now....and try to take half of what he says and put it to todays standards....but maybe we should all go see it ....I know I been on the opposite side of this debate....but I've always felt like something wasn't right about the way we went into this war....but "I said nothing" >>GO Figure'....It was after all my opinion......End of that..... However....Tonight as you go to bed and you think about something that was said in this talk today with
 Friends .....Please remember that Person that has "put on that uniform,..picked that gun ...and stood his Watch "so we can sleep in Peace one more night"...As tears flow for this special week -end...Let Freedom Ring....with all My Love to you all...Kandace...

Troy Allen <troy_allen1 at hotmail.com> wrote: -From Below-
I have talked to many people who say their kids in Iraq tell them not to 
vote for Bush.They say they cannot say why now but well tell them when they 
get home ...

You forget, I have several friends over there too. One sent home the story 
that we're doing the right thing. It seems as though a small girl came up to 
him and asked if she could practice her English on him. When he said yes, 
she began reciting the Lord's Prayer.
Still others say that Americans are seen as the heroes in most parts of the 
country and we have overwhelming support. The insurgents that we're having 
to fight now are the radical extremists who don't want peace, don't want 
prosperity and above all don't want happiness. All we can do fort these are 
to pray for them that they'll some day make peace with Ala or whoever they 
pray to and that they won't be abler to do much damage while they still hold 
these views. -end quote

now charles,
while i do agree with you on most of your views of the subject i have 
to point this out. the problem isn't that these people don't want peace, 
prosperity, and happiness, the problem is that they don't realize that we 
want these things for them and are trying to help them achieve it. they see 
things the way they have been taught to see them because in the time since 
their last misadventure with america an entire generation of children has 
come of age to bear arms. they are only going in the direction that their 
fathers, mothers, and saddam have pointed them. they do value peace and 
happiness, the problem comes in that they do not know any other way to 
attempt to achieve it. they also believe that the are achieving peace, peace 
with allah who teaches them that peace is divine and they should do whatever 
they must to reach it. it is a neverending circle we are encountering in 
iraq with these "freedom fighters". as long as they are shooting at us, we 
must shoot back to defend ourselves. therefore, they will never see that we 
are actually trying to help. they only see that americans are shooting at 
them. they are, as far as i am concerned, naive and to be pittied. i, and i 
am sure you do too, want things to be wonderful for them. however, if they 
have to do things the hard way then let them. we could nuke the entire 
desert untill it turns to glass if we wanted, then there would be no more 
problem in iraq. i hope only that i will someday show the dedication and 
fervor in my tasks that they show in their struggle.



>From: "charles netterville" To: "kandace harris" ,"jackie Leslie" ,"Max" 
>,"richard &drebra Parrish" ,"Karen Picou" ,"amy" ,"buddy" ,"darren&cindy" 
>,"Amy Eckert" ,"Robert Isaacson" ,"Marsha k Taylor" Subject: Re: Fahrenheit 
>9/11 a rebuttal Date: Mon, 5 Jul 2004 10:40:06 -0500
>
>I'll need to respond to these issues one at a time. Read along with what 
>you wrote and I'll respond throughout. Personally I don't care about 
>political affiliation. I'm going to vote for the man who can get the job 
>done. Personal note. This is only a debate among friends. This is how I 
>feel about it and I hope you will too. By the way, this is what I do for 
>fun when I'm not playing S.C.A. I still love you, Charles ----- Original 
>Message ----- From: kandace harris To: charles netterville ; jackie 
>Leslie ; Max ; richard &drebra Parrish ; Karen Picou ; amy ; buddy ; 
>darren&cindy ; Amy Eckert ; Robert Isaacson ; Marsha k Taylor Sent: 
>Monday, July 05, 2004 2:21 AM Subject: Re: Fahrenheit 9/11 a rebuttal
>
>
> Charles, I know what I forward...Do you understand what you 
>replied...Michael Moore is a film journalist not a Marxist....and If you 
>had watched CNN like other people did ,you would know that George W. did 
>say that this movie had no place being shown in the U.S. and that it would 
>only injury the moral of out troops..
>
> Kandace, Moore has made this known for years. The fact that he utilizes 
>his media forum to propagate his far leftist thinking does nothing more 
>than to discredit him as a journalist. Were his accusations concise and 
>correct I wouldn't have said a word about it... So far as GW's words, an 
>opinion so widely held is still not a call to be banned. No legislation was 
>even introduced to that end.
>
> and of course the White House can't ban a movie in an election year...
>
> The White house can't ban a movie even when it's NOT an election year. 
>Fortunately we don't live in a Marxist or communist country.
>
> and I would like to see a Government ran By the People for the people 
>... you say he's a leftist who wants capitalism ..
>
> Oh no... He doesn't like capitalism... He'd rather the government 
>control every part of the private sector and believes that we're too 
>ignorant to offer a viable role in our futures. He's stated this on 
>numerous occasions at various events. Ever heard a Michael Moore interview?
>
> you seen to do O.K. on a capitalism income...and gun control.... do you 
>really need that .38 revolver to kill a deer to put food on the table....I 
>think not ..but you do want that .38 when that intruder comes busting' 
>in....but if that intruder had a job and resources, think he'd be an 
>intruder?......Charles,my 20 gage shot gun will do the trick and you don't 
>even have to be a good aim..just raise and fire...
>
> Now you know that's not the point... The constitutions says Government 
>shall make NO LAW, not limit the language of the law to exclude, or 
>government shall not make many laws, It says NO law. If they're allowed to 
>bastardize our constitution even in the slightest, it arguable that a total 
>ban is just around the corner. ( by the way, that's exactly how it happened 
>in Germany in the twenties... Remember what happened to them less than 
>three decades later. ) What keeps us safe is that intruder doesn't know 
>for sure whether I have a .38, a shot gun or and AK47 assault rifle. It 
>goes back to those immortal words. ( do ya feel lucky punk? )
>
> and if you think for one minute I'm slandering g our Country or our 
>Military you couldn't be more wrong ..I love this Country and My first 
>Husband died in Viet Nam...and believe me when I say, I did my bit for God 
>and Country.....
>
> Oh NO, hold on just a minute here. I said you wore the uniform of this 
>proud country and offered reaffirmation to that... Nowhere did I even hint 
>that you personally slandered this nation or it's president and I would 
>never think that. Of all points of this debate, that's the one point I want 
>made perfectly clear.
>
> you say you want a limited government and increased personal 
>responsibility..where was your voice when George W. got brother Jeb to help 
>out in Florida ..
>
> The New York Times and several others have gone over the recounts time 
>and time again and every one of them come up with the same thing... Bush 
>won the state fair and square. The fact that Moore and others like him 
>don't like it and have a platform to air their grievances are the only 
>reasons we keep hearing about it.
>
>
> are you aware that the U.N. last Friday sent a message the United States 
>that in their oppion the U.N.should over see this year Elections.....maybe 
>some one better watch ...
>
> Um, that's not what CNN or CSPAN reported. The UN never offered or make 
>the attempt to step in. Those requests came from right here in our country 
>from more who didn't like the outcome of the last election and would still 
>love to have it cast a pal over the election results.
>
> They say we went to war because of resolutions that had been broken by 
>Saddam, The U.N. went in and couldn't find them.....yet when we got there 
>we couldn't seem to find those problems existed either....All the so called 
>dangerous things we found,have all been proven to be plants like we have 
>...they make legal products that are sold in their country as well as 
>exported to other counties...
>
> Now I'm just shaking my head. This has been all over the news, all over 
>the internet. Even the talk stations have picked it up trying to explain it 
>away. The fact is that the weapons are there, they were there 15 years ago 
>and they had 12 to hide them. We're only finding the ones now that weren't 
>hidden very well. Too much documentation's available for you to dispute 
>this fact. I'm surprised you tried.
>
> One terrible plant that they bombed made baby products...the things that 
>were found, we have ourselves...things that can be mixed togather in all 
>kinds of different ways.....
>
> So this is the reason that these perfectly innocent chemical components 
>are buried in hidden underground bunkers? Come on now... If you're 
>producing a legitimate product for legal export why do you bury the drums 
>in hopes that they won't be discovered?
>
> right down the road are over 56 plants..in a100 miles area....from Lake 
>Charles to Houston...Just like them....you want to talk about breaking 
>resolutions and the killing of 300,000 of it own people,..have you looked 
>into Sudan lately?...and..The last I heard ,was that a guy name Ben Landon 
>and his ban of terrorist bombed the Towers 3 years ago ... Where is Ben 
>Landon...and are you sure about Kuwait...12-13 years ago we were 32 miles 
>from Baghdad had it surrounded and at the last moment were told to STAND 
>DOWN....we could have taken Saddam out then ...and oh yes,wasn't it 
>Pres.Mr. Bush that did that one?.....
>
> Sure was. and to this day I and several hundred thousand young men and 
>women regret that political move too. Any guesses as to who lobbied for 
>that decision and publicly praised George Sr. for that move? You guessed 
>it. Al Gore, John Kerry, Ted Kennedy, Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton among 
>others. Every one of them are on record and can be accessed at the library 
>of congress. So far as Bin Laden goes, Clinton had him handed to him on a 
>silver platter on more than one occasion. Once we know was while a sniper 
>had him in his sights with a clear shot. Let's not muddy the waters trying 
>to place blame on an administration who assumed the problems of a previous 
>administration and was unfortunately too late. One thing about George W. 
>..... He could sell an Eskimo and Ice box and make him think he got a good 
>deal...Well I would say you bought the double doors with the bottom freezer 
>...and Dick Chainey didn't get where he is by being a "really nice guy"...I 
>kno w I use to work for him ..He is smart and he can be self 
>servicing....and yes it maybe all volunteer military but half of them are 
>in because there are NO jobs other than the service...we should not go to 
>war because George W. wants too ..we should go to war because we HAVE 
>too...this was not a "have too"...
>
> Are you trying to say that you want idiots running the country? Of 
>course Bush and Cheney are both shrewd business men. He wouldn't have 
>anybody's support if he couldn't run the country like a business. I never 
>cared for what Clinton did to the image of the Presidency but I always 
>marveled at his shrewd and charismatic stance to every situation that 
>confronted him. That's why he was so popular. So far as the jobs market 
>goes, have you not been watching the news where over a million new jobs 
>have been created over the last two years? Can you say tax cuts and 
>economic stimulace? Thank George and the conservatives for that one too my 
>dear because the left voted against it every time Including John Kerry...
>
> Who are these people that bid on Nerve gas stuff.....do you really think 
>anybody in the world would go to Iraq to buy Nerve gas ,for what, to start 
>another war, with another country or with Us???...we are now in the 
>Billions of Dollars into this war and these are the same people that have 
>the ability and the means to rebuild their on Country...they have as much 
>resources that we do ...we had an exit plan in every war but 
>Nam....BUT...that was a Police action...NOT a war.(and we did not fix Nam 
>back...we left it...)..soooo we have always had a game plan....to go in and 
>get out ..it is the ways and reason you go into war .....
>
> We're not talking about game plan, we're talking about exit strategies. 
>You said yourself, go in, get out. We do it after the bad guys are dead or 
>they surrender, right? Well, some of the bad guys are still alive and we 
>don't have a viable term for surrender so we're utilizing the exact same 
>exit strategy as before, right? You said it yourself. The people who would 
>want these nerve agents aren't going to Iraq by the way, they're the 
>murderers and terrorists who are already there seeking to kill our brothers 
>and sisters, sons and daughters... Are you mad yet? I know you are, but is 
>it redirecting in the right direction?
>
> And you talk about them attacking Gods people and others...well, If your 
>a beleiver , that is in the bible (Matt:24-25) and your not supose to worry 
>about it ,God will take care of it........
>
> God is taking care of it Kandace. He's blessed us with a strong military 
>and the superior knowledge to conquer this foe. He's also blessed us with 
>the strongest Christian founded country on the face of the planet who 
>doesn't back down from evil. I have talked to many people who say their 
>kids in Iraq tell them not to vote for Bush.They say they cannot say why 
>now but well tell them when they get home ...
>
> You forget, I have several friends over there too. One sent home the 
>story that we're doing the right thing. It seems as though a small girl 
>came up to him and asked if she could practice her English on him. When he 
>said yes, she began reciting the Lord's Prayer. Still others say that 
>Americans are seen as the heroes in most parts of the country and we have 
>overwhelming support. The insurgents that we're having to fight now are the 
>radical extremists who don't want peace, don't want prosperity and above 
>all don't want happiness. All we can do fort these are to pray for them 
>that they'll some day make peace with Ala or whoever they pray to and that 
>they won't be abler to do much damage while they still hold these views.
>
> One thing about this is that we can still agree to disagree ....Let me 
>leave you with something ...Up in N.Y.City there is a museum that house 
>things from the Holocaust ...and there's this note that was written some 
>where ,some when,...and It say,"when they came for the Polls, I said 
>nothing,..when they came for the Germans, I said nothing ...when they can 
>for the Jews, I said nothing...now that they have come for me ,there is no 
>one left to say anything"...I will never Shut my mouth ....Thank God in 
>this United State We can still say anything,...that why George W.... WILL 
>NOT get my vote....
>
> But that's exactly why he should. Have you learned nothing from our 
>Jewish brothers and sisters who fell at the hands of a maniacal tyrant? You 
>can vote for anyone you choose, but please don't try to sway my vote with 
>unsubstantiated propaganda from the farce of a journalist such as Michael 
>Moore. God Bless the U.S.A. In servitiae Christe et Coronae Chuck
>
>
>
> Kandace, First of all you need to know what you're forwarding 
>here. Michael Moore is a Marxist who would like nothing more than to see 
>this country run solely by the government. He's one of those leftist 
>radicals who want capitalism and free enterprise banned and supports gun 
>control, abortion and has hated the republican party and everyone else that 
>stands for limited government and increased personal responsibility since 
>his youth. This is not the first propaganda film he's generated and it 
>certainly won't be the last. The first thing that should be corrected 
>is that the White house made NO attempt to ban this, or any other film 
>being produced at this time or any other. We as Americans have the freedom 
>of speech in this country regardless if they're trying to slander the 
>good name of our country, our president and our military. Almost two 
>dozen of the ( facts ) that this militant proscribes as truth have been 
>determined to be either outright fabrications or such a stretch of the 
>original truth that there's no way to discern where the truth starts and 
>Michael's fable begins. This is an election year so we all expect the 
>Democrats to pull out all the stops to try and regain the power of the 
>Executive, the Senate and the House branches of the government, however, 
>it's up to us to arm ourselves with the facts and truth of Michael Moore, 
>the left and what the new Democratic party stands for. I can sympathize 
>because I too have been raised Democratic and I still believe in the values 
>set forth by the founding Democratic party. Unfortunately, the current 
>representatives of that party do not. It's time for each of to have the 
>courage to cross party boundaries and support the values and ideals that 
>our founding fathers set forth and not pigeon hole ourselves into a one 
>party right, one party wrong mentality as Mr. Moore would have us believe. 
> For instance, I know he doesn't care for the idea of the war, and who 
>really does like war, right? But if you'll think back, none of his 
>assertions make much sense. We went to Iraq because of 17 U.N. 
>resolutions that had been broken, 300,000 of his own countrymen slaughtered 
>in just the previous year and a direct threat to the world in the form of 
>an attack on Kuwait as the primary cause of action. The fact that everyone 
>from Bush Sr., Bill Clinton and the world intelligence for years has been 
>claiming W.M.D.s , not just our current President. The left would love for 
>us to believe this and use it as just cause to fire our president in the 
>next election. And if these charges held even the slightest truth, I 
>would... The weapons that we've found have included a large supply of 
>Uranium, but since it wasn't refined or in a warhead, we call it a WMD, 
>let's see, there's the hundreds of barrels of components to mix a variety 
>of nerve agents, poisons and other chemical agents, but they were only 
>components and could have been used for other things, surely they weren't 
>the WMDs, We've found several hundred Serrin gas cartridges only 
>recently mixed in and about thousands of weapons and munitions dumps around 
>the country but we just don't seem to be hearing about this except for our 
>friends who are there now and are having them pointed at them so surely we 
>can't call those WMDs either. We also have the stockpile of nerve agent 
>that had to be purchased only a week ago when world intelligence learned 
>that terrorists were bidding on the stockpile and these agents bought them 
>instead. Are those the WMDs that don't exist??? I've given up trying but I 
>won't give up on my belief that this is the greatest country on the planet 
>and we either support it or have the decency top keep our mouths shut so 
>that we don't discourage our boys ( who by the way are all volunteers, they 
>choose to be there ) fighting to preserve our way of life. Keep this in 
>mind too. We're being told that since only 57 % of Iraqis support the new 
>government and regime change that we're obviously doing the wrong thing by 
>being there. There was a war only 200 years ago that only held a 17 % 
>approval rating among the populace of the country but the founders felt 
>strongly enough about it to move forward and declare independence anyway. 
>That would have been the United States of America... Aren't you glad our 
>founding fathers didn't pay attention to the polls either? Also, you've 
>worn the uniform of service for our great nation. In all of your studies, 
>have you ever seen a war strategy that had an exit strategy??? Come on now. 
>We go in, we fight until we kill the bad guys or they surrender, we sign 
>terms of surrender , we rebuild what we blew up and go home. That's been 
>the exit strategy of every war we've ever fought in regardless of who sent 

=== message truncated ===




Kandyce of Oakcliff
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