[ANSTHRLD] Fw: Academy of Saint Gabriel Report for Client 2564

Sat Sep 28 12:17:37 PDT 2002

Ok Gang,

The client is me and I'm thinking of registering my alternate personnae name
"Zelda the Begger".  This is what the Academy found for me.  What do you
think?  Should I attempt to register the name as above or the alternate
possible of "Zelda der Bettler"???

Let me know your thoughts...but then I knew you would.  :)
Annes
Dear God,  Help me to be the person
my dog thinks I am.  Amen
----- Original Message -----
From: "Academy of Saint Gabriel" <academy at s-gabriel.org>
To: <hlannes at ev1.net>
Sent: Friday, September 27, 2002 2:58 PM
Subject: Academy of Saint Gabriel Report for Client 2564

> Greetings from the Academy of St. Gabriel!
>
> You wrote to us asking whether the names <Griselda>, <Griszelda> or
> <Zelda> were in use between 750 and 1250, and if so, in what
> cultures.  You indicated that you are looking for information on
> whether a name you are currently using, <Zelda the Beggar>, might
> have been used during this time.
>
> We'd like to apologize for how long it has taken us to respond, and
> hope that our information is still useful to you.
>
> <Zelda> or <Zelde> is a Yiddish name, deriving from a Christian name,
> which was in use during the Middle Ages and Renaissance in Jewish
> communities in Germany and Eastern Europe. [1] However, we haven't
> been able to find evidence that it was used before 1250. Our earliest
> reference for the name is a woman who died in Germany in 1298. [2]
> During the thirteenth and fourteenth centuries, Jewish people were
> migrating east into Slavic countries, and Yiddish naming practices
> went with them. Our information about how and where particular names
> traveled is too sketchy to generalize from, but one source may
> indicate that <Zelda> was being used in Poland by c. 1400. [3]
>
> We have not found any evidence that <Zelda> was used as a pet form of
> <Griselda> until modern times.  <Griselda> itself seems to first
> appear in England in the 14th century as the name of a character in
> Chaucer's "Canterbury Tales."  [7,8] It was used in England in a
> variety of forms in the sixteenth century. Some of these are in the
> list below.
>
>   Gresilda 1509 [5]
>   Grisella 1545 [4]
>   Grizill  1546 [9]
>   Grysell  1550 [9]
>   Gryssell 1551 [10]
>   Gresell  1552 [4]
>   Grisill  1574 [4]
>   Greezill 1587 [10]
>   Grysell  1607 [11]
>
> In conclusion, the name <Zelda> may have been used during the later
> part of your period; it is not an implausible name for a thirteenth-
> century Jewish woman in Germany or Eastern Europe.  We have found no
> evidence that <Griselda> existed until the 14th century, and none that
> it was used until somewhat later, in England.
>
> We find a number of examples of the surname <Beggar> in England in the
> 13th century and onwards: [5]
>
>   Beggere    1210-11
>   le Beggare 1275
>   Beggestere 1301
>   Beggare    1314
>
> The third on the list, <Beggestere>, is a specifically feminine
> form.  At this time, such bynames were likely used literally.
> However, by the 16th century, when forms of <Griselda> were in use in
> England, bynames were no longer literal, but fixed, inherited
> surnames (as in modern times).  Though we have no examples of this
> surname from the 16th century, we believe it was still in use, though
> rarely. [13]  The name <Grisill Begger> is plausible for 16th century
> England, but the surname would have meant only that the woman's
> father was also surnamed <Begger>; it would not have implied anything
> more specific about her.
>
> We don't have enough information about 13th to 16th century German
> Jewish women's names to say what kinds of bynames they used, or
> whether a German or Yiddish descriptive term would be more
> appropriate.  In German, a byname meaning "beggar" is <Bettlerin>.
> This is the standard feminine form of a byname that we found in
> masculine in several instances: <Bethelmann> 1233, <Betilare> 1244,
> <dictus Betelman> 1297, <der Bettler> 1320, and <der Betler> 1383.
> [6,12]  We are not sure how appropriate these German bynames would be
> for a Jewish woman; the majority of our records concerning Jewish
> women are in Hebrew, and women are recorded either with a Hebrew
> byname or with no byname at all. [3]  It is certainly possible for a
> Jewish woman to have been recorded with a German byname in a non-
> Jewish record, though.
>
> We hope that this letter has been useful to you, and that you will
> not hesitate to write again if any part was unclear or if you have
> further questions.  We were assisted in researching and writing this
> letter by Walraven van Nijmegen, Julie Stampnitzky, Talan Gwynek,
> Arval Benicoeur, Adelaide de Beaumont, Joshua haLevi, and Laurensa de
> Chambord.
>
> For the Academy,
>
> Raquel Buenaventura & Aryanhwy merch Catmael
> _______________________________________________________________
> References
>
> [1] Beider, Alexander, _A Dictionary of Ashkenazic Given Names and
> their History_ (Avotaynu, 2001) s.n. Zelde
>
> [2] Salfeld, Siegmund, _Das Martyrologium des Nu:rnberger
> Memorbuches_, Quellen zur Geschichte der Juden in Deutschland, vol. 3
> (Berlin: Verlag von Leonhard Simion, 1898). p. 413
>
> [3] The Jewish Genealogical Society of Great Britain, _Index to the
> Kalish Book for Surnames Up To C_
> http://www.jgsgb.org.uk/nibs04b.htm
>   The reference in this source to <Zelda> is somewhat ambiguous and
> the book itself is of unknown though probably good accuracy.  If
> accurate, this source indicates that <Zelda> or something similar was
> by a Polish Jew ca.1300.  The text says:
>
> "From the middle of the 14th century Jews begin to appear more
> frequently by name, being referred to in various legal records as
> claiming payment of debts, most of which are by no means
> considerable.  Names found in these lists include: Michael, Abraham,
> Yehudya, David, Daniel, Shabdai (Sabbathai), Aaron, Shlomo, Jonah,
> Michael. Women mentioned include Zelda, Zemela, and Dina. Other names
> are Jurdan, Kavian, and Benish."
>
> [4] Bardsley, Charles, _A Dictionary of English and Welsh Surnames_
> (Baltimore: Genealogical Publishing Company, 1980). s.nn. Askew,
> Baptist, Knightley
>
> [5] Reaney, P. H., & R. M. Wilson, _A Dictionary of English Surnames_
> (London: Routledge, 1991; Oxford University Press, 1995).  s.nn.
> Beggar, Hende
>
> [6] Brechenmacher, Josef Karlmann, _Etymologisches Woerterbuch der
> deutschen Familiennamen_ (Limburg a. d. Lahn, C. A. Starke-Verlag,
> 1957-1960). s.n. Bettler
>
> [7] Withycombe, E.G., _The Oxford Dictionary of English Christian
> Names_, 3rd ed. (Oxford: Oxford University Press, 1988). s.n. Griselda
>
> [8] Dunkling, Leslie and William Gosling, _The New American Dictionary
> of First Names_ (New York: Signet Books, 1983). s.nn. Griselda, Zelda
>
> [9] Bardsley, Charles Wareing, _Curiosities of Puritan Nomenclature_
> (Detroit: Gale Research Company, 1970). pp 103, 109
>
> [10] The Parish Registers of St. Michael, Cornhill, London,
> Containing the Marriages, Baptisms, and Burials from 1546 to 1754.
> Partly edited by Joseph Lemuel Chester. The Publications of the
> Harleian Society: Registers, Vol. VII (London: 1882).
>
> [11] Marriages from the Whickham Registers (1534-1654) (WWW: GEN UKI,
> 1996)
> http://www.cs.ncl.ac.uk/genuki/Transcriptions/DUR/WHK1579.html
>
> [12] Socin, Adolf, _Mittelhochdeutsches Namenbuch. Nach
> oberrheinischen Quellen des 12. und 13. Jahrhunderts_ (Basel: Helbing
> & Lichtenhahn, 1903; Hildesheim: Georg Olms Verlagsbuchhandlung,
> 1966). p. 616
>
> [13] "Hampshire County, WV, County Court Minute Book, 1788-89" (WWW:
> Cheryl H. Singhal, 2001) lists a <Joaob Beggard> from 1788.
> http://www.rootsweb.com/~wvhampsh/mntbk.htm, accessed 15Sep02
>
> Also, the following website lists an <Elizabeth Begger> who married
> in 1806:
> http://www.fortunecity.com/boozers/ship/208/dat82.htm
>
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
> The Academy of Saint Gabriel is not affiliated with the SCA College
> of Arms and does not register or return names or arms.  We only
> give advice on historical accuracy.  For more information, please
> read http://www.s-gabriel.org/disclaimer.html or send e-mail to
> academy at s-gabriel.org with the word "Disclaimer" in the subject.
>
> A copy of this report is available on the web at
> http://s-gabriel.org/2564.
>