[ANSTHRLD] FW: Devise in progress: William Black Dragon (Ironwyrm)
Don and Monica
dmriney at earthlink.net
Thu Feb 26 06:04:35 PST 2004
well if he doesn't mind german there is Willhelm Schwartz von Worms
Darius
----- Original Message -----
From: Brent.Ryder at compucom.com
To: heralds at ansteorra.org
Cc: magnus77840 at hotmail.com ; arbalest at ansteorra.org
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 7:22 AM
Subject: [ANSTHRLD] FW: Devise in progress: William Black Dragon (Ironwyrm)
Howdy,
Please read the following and see if there is something in the way of a plausible name based on the given info. The user is trying to work with us and I am in hopes we can work something out for him.
Let me know what you come up with
Borek
Bordure
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From: ironwyrm at juno.com [mailto:ironwyrm at juno.com]
Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 6:09 PM
To: Ryder, Brent (bryder)
Cc: Ryder, Brent (bryder)
Subject: Re: Devise in progress: William Black Dragon (Ironwyrm)
On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 09:38:13 -0600 <Brent.Ryder at compucom.com> writes:
> > >I have started working on my devise & badge submission again,
> using
> > >a suggestion of Rumil's, taking a name and canting the devise to
> > >reflect it as that name visibly from a 100 yards away.
>
> Good to hear :)
Yeah, no more pouting about it, let's just get it done!
>
> > >Canting Ironwyrm: The color of iron (black) and a wyrm
> (dragon),
> > >descriptively making a "black dragon" or "iron wyrm" as the
> visual.
>
> So you are going to register William (Uillam?) Black Dragon for
> your
> name? The only registration I found so far was for a 'Black Dragon
> Herald' in another kingdom.
Haven't thought of that!?! I'm having a great deal of
trouble finding any type of last name for those lower than
high born in late eleventh, early twelfth century Britain.
Saxons were adopting Norman names to avoid oppression.
Anyone from the army rank of Sergeant, middle class, or
below seldom seems have last names other than descriptive,
occupational, locational or nicknames. Such as "Stephen de
Bulmer", "Robert son of Leonard", "William fitz Alan", "John
the Cook", "Orderic the Smith", "Godric of Finchale", "William
of Malmesbury", "Roger God-save-the-Ladies", and of
course how could we not mention "Roland the Farter" a jester
of some dubious renown.
All seem Influenced by Norman, Anglo Saxon/Scandinavian,
Flemish, French and the occasional Welsh background.
William is not hard to document as common and popular
name around that period (example - "When Henry the
young King held court in Normandy at Christmas 1171
the guests supposedly included 110 knights named 'William'.
They got together in one room and refused to let anyone
in to eat with them unless they were called 'William'").
(The original idea behind "Ironwyrm" was a nickname used
to differ from all the other Williams. Planned persona being an
early upper-middle class merchant/alchemist/artillerist
experimenting with and trying to sale the idea of primitive black
powder artillery to the Crowns of Europe (first recorded use of
such during a siege in France 1243).
Current working persona is high born/upper middle Norman/
Brittany mix, raised western England late eleventh century,
relocated to Norman held Sicily, campaigned against Moors as
arbalist/archer commander & siege engineer, turned merchant
early in twelfth century.
As for the name, I am not as dead set on "Ironwyrm" as I was, and
have accepted that it will only be a nickname much as in period.
I would be willing to just register "William" and let it go at that,
but that doesn't work for the SCA. So what I am interested in
doing is getting my devise and badge registered and that requires
an SCA name. I understand that a "holding name" may be used
to register a devise & badge, if so I would like to do that should
the next name submission be rejected.
As a "holding name" I would be open to:
"William" - "Wyrm"(but not Worm), "Iron", or any variation of
archery, hunting, woodlands, or location in western England such as
(the or of) "Archer", "Bowman", "Arbalist", "Huntsman", "Forester",
"Tracker", "Greenwood", "Briars", "Brambles', "Thicket", "Essex",
"Rutland", "Huntingdon", "Pickering", "Yorkshire", or "Nottingham".
I'd even be willing to accept "William the Farter" if they will accept
it as a "holding name".
As SCA name I would still wish "William Ironwyrm", but with
no documentable examples I see little hope of that happening.
The last possibility discussed with me was submitting as:
"William Iron Wyrm' (no changes)
But if you have a documentable "Black Dragon" I would
be open to submitting as:
"William Black Dragon" in any variation of old English,
Latin, French, Scandinavian, or Flemish that might work.
I'm so bad at onomastics that I cannot
> tell
> you if this is a viable name construction or not.
Don't know myself, nor would I have any Idea whom to ask?
>
> OK, blazon fu, "Argent, a dragon couchant, wings elevated and
> addorsed,
> and a chief rayonny sable."
Thank's, that will help a lot!
>
> Did a conflict check and did not find a conflict which I found a
> bit
> surprising. There are actually very few devices with a 'dragon
> couchant'
> at all.
Good, that's what I was shooting for!
>
> Let me know how I can help from here
Just let me know what you think about the "holding name"
idea when you get time and if that will work I'll pick something
& restart the paperwork!
Thanks for your assistance!
Ironwyrm
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