[ANSTHRLD] Radei Drchevich appeal

[radei at moscowmail.com]

Part of my idea is from a mundane form that I can claim right to, that being "argent, a lozenge throughout gules" this is dated 1024, and given to a distant grandfather on my mothers side.

> ----- Original Message -----
> From: tmcd at panix.com
> To: "Heralds List, Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA,  Inc." <heralds at lists.ansteorra.org>
> Subject: Re: [ANSTHRLD] Radei Drchevich appeal
> Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2007 23:37:45 -0500 (CDT)
> 
> 
> On Thu, 23 Aug 2007, kevinkeary at aol.com <heralds at lists.ansteorra.org> wrote:
> > if I understand this correctly, in this case the lozenge throughout
> > Radei wants is considered the same as a field vetu,
> 
> They are exactly identical visually.
> 
> > and that [vetu, presumably] is considered a field treatment
> 
> To be technical, vetu is what the SCA calls a "parted field" or "field
> division", not a "field treatment".  According to the College of Arms
> Glossary of Terms, <http://sca.org/heraldry/coagloss.html>,
> 
>      Partition. A division of the field into pieces that have different
>      tinctures. Some partitions follow and are named after ordinaries,
>      like per pale, per fess, per bend, and per saltire; others have
>      their own names, like checky, lozengy, and quarterly.
> 
>      Field Treatment. A repeating pattern drawn in a tincture with good
>      contrast over the field or a charge. Field treatments leave more of
>      the underlying tincture showing than they cover. They are considered a
>      part of the field or charge tincture. The term field treatment is not
>      a standard real-world heraldic description for a class of armorial
>      designs, but is the SCA catch-all term for the few period heraldic
>      designs meeting this description. Field treatments include masoned and
>      the forms of papellony and scaly which are drawn as voided
>      scales.
> 
> There are some rules distinctions between them.
> 
> > (making the mullet the primary)?if?that will cause conflict with
> > another device, and considered a primary charge (making the mullet a
> > tertiary) if THAT will cause conflict.? Maximizing conflicts however
> > possible.
> 
> I don't know what character[s] you're typing, but please use just the
> plain keyboard characters: other systems may display curly quotation
> marks or em-dashes as "?", as above.
> 
> > Makes it seem like the system is specifically geared to discourage
> > the use of fields vetu.
> 
> Not at all, though given that vetu and lozenges throughout were quite
> rare in period, I don't think that side effect is bad.
> 
> It's the principle enunciated in other messages -- "you can't blazon
> your way out of a conflict".  In this case, it's pretty
> straightforward, because vetu looks exactly like a lozenge throughout.
> Without this principle, then I could submit "Argent, a chief gules and
> a base azure" and claim that it's clear by X.1 (or by 4 CDs) from the
> flag of the Netherlands, "Per fess gules and azure, a fess argent",
> even though they're absolutely identical.
> 
> It's like another principle: if there's some way to get from one
> design to another in fewer than two CDs (and neither X.2 nor X.1 save
> your butt), then there's a conflict.  Without this principle, I can
> add a griffin proper to a design and then remove it for two CDs and
> clear any two conflicts, or claim a less obvious around-Robin-Hood's-
> barn set of changes to "clear" close neighbors.
> 
> Danet de Linccolne
> --
> Tim McDaniel; Reply-To: tmcd at panix.com
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>



Radei
Vasil House of the Red Shark
Guild of St. Camillus de Lellis

This we know: All things are connected.
Like the blood which unites one family,
All things are connected.
Whatever befalls the earth,
Befalls the sons of the earth.
Man did not weave the fabric of life,
He is merely a strand on it.

- Chief Seattle




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