[ANSTHRLD] OP question - Court Baronies and Baronies in fief

[Jay Rudin]

Sara wrote:


> Which works great for original scrolls, but doesn't
> help me as Golden Scroll, where I am limited to our
> existing charters (which use the text on pg 49 of the
> Award Texts document).

Theoretically, a legal charter carries the date is was issued, even if it 
announces a legal change that takes place on some other date.  It has to --  
they can only issue charters during their reign, even though the effect of 
those charters outlives their reign.

The best possible solution would be to have a charter that handles the 
situation.  If you had a charter based on the p. 51 text, this would be 
easy.  You're trying to use a document that ennobles somebody at the moment 
of issue for a situation in which something different is happening.  It's 
like giving a Star with a simple Grant of Arms scroll (which has happened in 
the past).  The legal document doesn't state all the legal matter.

> Maybe I shouldn't use the
> existing charters for previous landeds, and should
> instead refer folks to Signet for originals?

That solution certainly works.  Signet won't love you for it.

> Bah, humbug! Someone please tell me there's some
> way to use our current charters for this...Serena?

The way to use our current charters for this is "inaccurately".  They don't 
describe the actual legal situation.

To be fair, most people wouldn't care about the legal details if they got a 
scroll to put on their wall.  And nobody uses a charter to establish their 
precedence.  Zodiacus never sees the charter.

I wish I had an easier answer to give you, but the legal situation is that 
this is a charter issued on one date, granting precedence from another date.

(Just be glad that you're not dealing with a harder situation.  One person 
in Ansteorra has a Court Barony with a precedence date that isn't either the 
date he became landed or the date his Court Barony was first issued.)

Robin of Gilwell / Jay Rudin
Baron of the Steppes, 2-13-1988
Court Barony, given by the Queen's hand, and with all rights and privileges 
dating from, 9-20-1984, but
Court Barony, precedence dating from 10-13-1984