[ANSTHRLD] question about baronial service order award charters

kevinkeary at aol.com kevinkeary at aol.com
Thu Aug 20 10:09:40 PDT 2009


A while back I tried to derive an answer to the question "If an 
incoming baron or baroness does not already have the baronial service 
award, are they given it with the barony? Sure they are the 
principal(s) while in the hotseat, but is that possession of the award 
temporary and only a part of their temporary tenure?"

Evidence in Ansteorra's OP seemed to indicate it could go either way -- 
I found numerous examples of ex-landeds with their service awards dated 
the same as their investiture date, and I found numerous examples of 
ex-landeds with their service awards dated after that, often after they 
had stepped down.

Someone, I forget who, told me it depended on how the order's charter 
was written. If the Oak doesn't HAVE a charter, I have no idea how to 
derive an answer.


-----Original Message-----
From: Jay Rudin <rudin at peoplepc.com>
Sent: Thu, Aug 20, 2009 11:52 am
Subject: Re: [ANSTHRLD] question about baronial service order award 
charters



Duncan asked:

>A dilemma has come up in how to fill in a charter for a person who did
>not have a baronial service award prior to becoming it's principal, so
>my question is this: Would their predecessor be considered as the one 
to
>give them that award? Themselves? The crown?

It can't be their predecessor, who is no longer in ofice.  It can't be
themselves -- that's illegal.  It has to be the Crown, who are in fact 
the ones
who call them up and give them the barony that it comes with.

When Allemanius became baron, he founded the barony.  There was no 
predecessor.

When Aureliane became baroness, Allemanius had not been baron for five 
months.
(Also, he was never baron in the kingdom of Ansteorra, and could never 
have
given anything to a baroness chosen by Ansteorra's Crown.)

When Exiter and Anne-Louise became baron and baroness, Aureliane has 
already
resigned the barony, and wasn't even at the event.

When Thorkell and Kalida became baron and baroness, I had wanted to 
give them
Oaks first, but the Queen said not to, because they'd be getting them a 
few
minutes later anyway.

In general, the old B&B step down and walk away, and only then are the 
new ones
called up and made B&B (and Oaks).  The old B&B are no longer B&B by 
then, and
have no authority to give out awards.

Robin of Gilwell / Jay Rudin

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