[ANSTHRLD] =?X-UNKNOWN?Q?Re=3A_=5BANSTHRLD=5D_Conflict_checking=2C_{TH}orkel?= =?X-UNKNOWN?Q?l_Olf=C3=BAss=2C_Device_blazon_Included?=

Tim McDaniel tmcd at panix.com
Mon Aug 23 06:55:00 PDT 2010


On Mon, 23 Aug 2010, Joshua Brandl <norfildur at hotmail.com> wrote:
> The charges, ordinaries and most of the heraldry information i have
> gathered from the Bingham Collection, a pictorial dictionary of
> Medieval Heraldry, Armour, Arms, Equipment, Clothing, and Myths.
> The base image for saltire nebuly is on the page available via the
> link below. the other charges are on their respective pages.
>
> http://heraldry-armoury-and-more.com/picture_library/NNN.htm

Thank you for pointing out the source.

It's really odd in this sense: neither the main page nor page N has
any indication of who Bingham was, what "the Bingham Collection" might
be (a book? papers of the late Mr. Bingham? collections of facts of
interest to a living Mr. Bingham?), who authored the text, who is
maintaining the site, date, links to other pages, e-mail address of
the maintainer, *anything*.  And Google Search shows nobody referring
to it except a couple of sites that I can't navigate that seem to be
scraping info off the Web.

Anyway, that's by the by.  Looking it over, briefly: it looks like it
was derived from a Victorian heraldic source of some sort.  Some
things looked reasonable (horseshoes).  Some made fussy distinctions
or notions that the SCA and perhaps real-world heraldry doesn't do
(e.g., nombril point, lioncels).  Some was out of heraldic treatises
and I don't know that they were done in period (blazoning by planets
and jewels in "Azure").  There was nonsense too (the "meanings" of
tinctures and charges).

If you want a Victorian source, Google for
     "james parker" heraldry
to get to <http://www.heraldsnet.org/saitou/parker/>  Lots more info,
lots more examples, still with the fussy distinctions, not anywhere
near as much nonsense.  Still not a great guide for SCA purposes,
but it's good for looking up if someone uses a weird heraldic term.

As for nebuly: I think I once ran across illustrations of period
nebuly showing various shapes, including even flatter and bi-lobed
ones than this ... but since I don't have a source or anything useful,
that's not data.  For most of the depictions, I'd suggest fewer and
larger/wider nebules.  But the saltire shown here *is* really too
large.  Seeing it, and especially the original illo of the device
design, I have a real foreground-background problem: I don't see
"Argent, a saltire nebuly sable", but rather "Sable, four odd
peripheral charges of some sort argent".

Danielis de Lindecolina
-- 
Tim McDaniel, tmcd at panix.com



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