[ANSTHRLD] Eldwin's Submission 1

Eldwin Nightowl eldwin at loveshade.org
Tue Jul 27 14:07:29 PDT 2010


Thanks a lot for your help, even though obviously it's not what I had hoped to hear.  Ironically, I had changed the field from azure to become argent with a hurt to avoid conflict I learned about with the device of Michael Maggotslayer http://roa.sca-caid.org/Emblazons/Michael_Maggotslayer.gif
 
Back to the drawing board.

 

--- On Tue, 7/27/10, Tim McDaniel <tmcd at panix.com> wrote:


From: Tim McDaniel <tmcd at panix.com>
Subject: Re: [ANSTHRLD] Eldwin's Submission 1
To: "Heralds List, Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <heralds at lists.ansteorra.org>
Date: Tuesday, July 27, 2010, 1:01 PM


On Tue, 27 Jul 2010, kevinkeary at aol.com wrote:
> Eldwin Nightowl <eldwin at loveshade.org> wrote:
> > http://eldwin.loveshade.org/images/Eldwin_Device_s.gif
> > Argent, on a hurt an owl displayed argent grasping in its
> > talons a quill pen to sinister Or.

The pen is "fesswise".  As to whether it's "to sinister" depends on
defaults ... ah, the Glossary of Terms says "In general, the end of a
charge that is to chief when the charge is palewise will be to dexter
when the same charge is placed fesswise (as if rotated 90 degrees
counterclockwise). A sword fesswise, for example, has its point to
dexter, and an arrow fesswise has its feathers to dexter. The most
common exception is the (quill) pen: when palewise, it has its nib to
base, but when it is fesswise, the nib is to dexter.".  Huh.  I Did
Not Know That.  "Fesswise reversed" it is, then, or "fesswise to
sinister", whichever you prefer on aesthetic grounds.

> Sorry, but this is a dead conflict with Galleron de Cressy
> Argent, on a hurt a wivern volant to sinister argent.
> Same field, same primary, no secondary on either, and the tertiary
> differs in type (and posture), not tincture or number.

Actually, you had it with "and the tertiary".  All the changes to a
single group of tertiaries cannot give more than one CD.

This is simple under RfS X.4.j.ii (no more than two types of charge
directly on the field and has no overall charges), so the substantial
difference between wyvern and owl gives the CD.  Even if X.4.j.ii did
not apply, the regular X.4.j.i rule with difference in type + posture
would give the CD.

Still only one CD total between the two designs, so they still
conflict.  I just wanted to clerify that there's one CD.


When calling a conflict, you can note the date of registration (July
1991 in this case), because it may hint whether a letter of permission
is more or less likely to be obtainable.  Galleron de Cressy is
currently on the SCA Grand Council, quoth Google, so he should be
reachable.  I'd still talk to the submitter about period-style
suggestions before proceeding anyway.  E.g., I think period quill
pens had most of the feathering removed, but I'm not sure.

Danyell Lincoln
-- Tim McDaniel, tmcd at panix.com
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