[ANSTHRLD] Conflict and Blazon Check - Assistance Needed

doug bell magnus77840 at hotmail.com
Wed Nov 24 12:05:24 PST 2010





	
	
	
	


Sorry, there is no difference between a heraldic and a natural dolphin.This also means the natural dolphin azure may also conflict with 
standard fish.  Back to the conflict checking.
Magnus

[June 2005 LoAR, A-Atlantia] Atlantia, Kingdom
of. 
Badge for Order of the Herring. (Fieldless) A herring urinant
argent.
This does not conflict with the badge for the Order of the Dolphin
of Caid, 
Azure, a dolphin embowed uriant to sinister argent.
There is a CD for 
fieldlessness and another for the difference
between a heraldic dolphin 
and a herring. Precedent states:

[Per fess engrailed azure and vert, in chief a natural dolphin
argent] ... 
this conflicts with Anton de Winton, Per chevron
azure, and Or scaly sable, 
in chief a herring naiant embowed argent.
There is one CD for changing the 
field. There is no difference for
changing the type of fish. A natural dolphin is not apparently a
period heraldic charge, and thus its difference from other 
charges
must be determined on visual grounds under RfS X.4.e. Comparing 
this
dolphin with Anton's herring, the outlines of the two charges are
very similar. 
They both have slightly forked tails (it is impossible
to tell whether the tail is 
supposed to have horizontal or vertical
flukes without resorting to internal 
details, and Anton's dolphin
lacks these). Both creatures have a dorsal fin 
and a forefin. The
"beak" or "bottle-nose" on a natural dolphin
helps identify it as a natural dolphin, but is not a sufficient
outline difference to give a CD 
from a herring.

Note that this ruling does not revoke the many rulings that grant
no difference between a heraldic and a natural dolphin. Given the
well established trends owards naturalism in Renaissance art and
Renaissance heraldic art, it is possible that a natural dolphin might
have been used as an artist's variant of a heraldic dolphin. 
Without
evidence for natural dolphins in period heraldry, the natural dolphin
will conflict both with heraldic dolphins and with standard-outlined
fish, like herring. 
[Helga Iden dohtir, 04/02, R-Caid]

However, conflict is not transitive and there is a CD between a
heraldic dolphin 
and a fish such as a herring. The precedent "There's
a CD between dolphins and 
most kinds of fish. (Alethea of Fair Isle,
October, 1992, pg. 16)" applies to 
heraldic dolphins, not
natural dolphins.

 > I am fairly sure there is at least a CD (and possibly X.2 difference)
> between a natural dolphin (aka bottle-nosed dolphin) and a heraldic
> dolphin, but that would take a short dig through the precedents to
> uncover the exact ruling. Fortunately, we don't have to, because there
> aren't any even close!

 		 	   		  


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