[Northkeep] Fighter practice

Catherine Lackey catanlac at yahoo.com
Thu Oct 6 19:11:48 PDT 2011


   "The seneschal has asked us to cease discussing this"...With all due respect, I do not accept that. I have the right to make my point of view known as much as any others that have made theirs, despite my coming late into this discussion.  If any feel I have not earned the right to do so, feel free to let me know.
       I was brought knowledge of what is going on by phone earlier today and have read all the postings on the subject so far.  I have big problems with what is happening; allow me to elucidate.
    1. There is more than one group that games at Fighter Practice.  My group did not attend last Tuesday night as we made an independent decision to not attend on the first Tuesday of the month as that is a business meeting time for the VFW and we would not be permitted the use of the dining hall.  To game in the fighter area, we felt, would be a mutual distraction not conducive to either activity.  Yet when we are told "no gaming will be allowed", based, presumably, on the incident that took place last Tuesday, we are being punished as well for whatever sins of omission or commission took place when we were not even present.
    2. Obviously, there has been longstanding resentment that some/many individuals have failed in their duty to be a
part of the weekly cleaning which is our price for using the VFW facilities.  I have been guilty of that failure myself. But except for complaints, no action was apparently ever contemplated doing anything to rectify the situation until now, when a signup sheet for cleanup duty is suggested.  The Knights' Marshal, in his unilateral announcement forbidding gaming activity, and in the posts supporting it since, singles out the gamers (all of us) to be used as whipping boys for the resentment over the lack of cleaning support from all members (except, apparently, those members of the heavy fighters who do not or rarely do their share.  By virtue of being heavy weapons fighters, do these individuals get a pass?). 

    3. It is a longstanding tradition in this Barony, for all the thirty-one years I have been a member of it, that other activities be a part of Fighter Practice.  That is part of the bargain of Fighter Practice being a Baronial activity and not a private activity in someone's back yard.  If the Knights' Marshal and the heavy weapons fighters choose to do what I have heard is suggested and make VFW fighter practices "unofficial" and thus without SCA sanction, please be advised that he would still have to have an official Fighter Practice at another time and place and attend same to be legal.  I question whether the Knights' Marshal can unilaterally declare Fighter Practice "off-limits" to a particular group, even if the seneschal should agree, and even if that decision is supported by a majority of the heavy weapons fighters.  Who is next?  According to the posts I read, many are accused of failing to consistently clean, such as the Rapier
 Fighters.  It seems acknowledged and believed that the VFW was obtained exclusively by and for the heavy fighters.  But it is called "Fighter Practice", not "Heavy Fighter Practice".  Are the Rapier fighters next to be marginalized (if they are not already) or forced out due to a consensus that they "don't really belong"?  Is the scribal guild next, or just people who come to hang out and chat?  How about newcomers?  What parties are less than welcome at this venue?

    4. It has been said that it is important that the "mind-set" of the fighters be preserved and any other activities around them are a distraction.  If that is the case, perhaps at all tournaments the fighting activities should take place in absolute privacy, watched and participated in only by likeminded fighters.  No observers, heralds, listmistresses need approach.  That would certainly preserve the mind-set, no?  The people who support the fighters, as above, as well as costumers, the Baron and Baroness, waterbearers, etc. would hardly be missed.  Likewise the fighters, when the tournament fighting in their bubble of privacy was done, would surely want to pack up their armor and be gone, and not waste time on tiresome feasts or court.  Of course that would make impossible the lavish processionals of elevation to knighthood like the one I saw a few weeks ago at Moonschadowe's baronial event.
The point I am making so laboriously is that heavy weapons fighting does not and cannot exist in a vacuum, and when you try to marginalize any other activity by saying it has no "right" to be a part of fighter practice, you may be technically correct, but you pursue that line of thought to your cost, ultimately.
    5. No venue for discussing these issues has been announced officially as of this writing.  I am given to understand unofficially that the fighters graciously agree to have a meeting to discuss policy on these matters next Tuesday night, but the meeting is to take place AFTER fighter practice.  During the fighter practice itself, the unilateral banishment of the gamers is to stand, BEFORE the meeting to discuss the validity of the banishment can take place!  If this is indeed the case, how is this fair or appropriate?  We are guilty, and punished, before having any opportunity to defend ourselves (even the gamers who were not present last Tuesday night and cannot have been a part of whatever happened then), or even to discuss avenues of redress for legitimate grievances in an appropriate manner?  Is this how far we have come, or fallen?
    I would like to see these points addressed before the next fighter practice.  I am more than glad to see longstanding grievances be appropriately handled in a positive manner, and I accept I must be part of the solution.  What I do not accept is marginalization and unilateral banishment of any other parties as a form of punishment and self-aggrandizement by a few.  That is not what the history of our Barony should bring us to.

                                                                              Sincerely, in service
                                                                              Baroness Catrin ferch Gwilym O Gonwy


________________________________
From: Kevinkeary <kevinkeary at aol.com>
To: glnn_jhn at yahoo.com; northkeep at lists.ansteorra.org
Sent: Wednesday, October 5, 2011 4:40 PM
Subject: Re: [Northkeep] Fighter practice


Actually, Sarran singled out one group of 'NON Baronial activities' to banish, not the light fighters or the calligraphers or any of the other 'Baronial activities'.

Regardless, the seneschal has asked us to cease discussing this, and I have nothing else to say anyway. I asked for information, and ther reply I got was that it has already been spelled out, basically that I should be smart enough to figure it out from what had been said. I responded in private with the reasons I did not think this was so, reasons I was concerned that whatever had happened could mean consequences to the barony, legal or reputation. I received no reply. Not that I deserve one. I try, believe it or not, to not claim rights I have not earned.

Regardless, I will be there to help clean when my schedule allows. Until and unless I hear differently, I will not bring any gaming accoutrements with me, and will not discuss gaming while I am there. There's really nothing left for me to say.

Good sirs, this field is yours.

Kevin
-----Original Message-----
From: Angus MacKnochard <glnn_jhn at yahoo.com>
To: The Barony of Northkeep <northkeep at lists.ansteorra.org>
Cc: northkeepfighters <northkeepfighters at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wed, Oct 5, 2011 4:26 pm
Subject: Re: [Northkeep] Fighter practice


All of Arthur's questions are valid, but irrelivant

he Heavy Fighter community has expressed concern over this issue from the time 
e first moved to the VFW.
This site was secured, by a heavy fighter, for Heavy Fighting. and because of 
hat we in Northkeep have the best, consistant practice in the north
In the begining we ALLOWED light fighters to share our site, under the promise 
hey WOULD help carry the burden, as a whole they have not
ater we ALLOWED other Baronial activities to share our site, under the promise 
hey WOULD help carry the burden, as a whole they have not.
ater yet we ALLOWED NON Baronial activities to share our site, under the 
romise they WOULD help carry the burden, as a whole they have not
We, the heavy fighting community of Northkeep, have raised our voices in the 
ast, and every time the participation of NON heavy fighters, improved, for a 
hort time.
We have publicly discussed closing the site to NON Heavy activities for over a 
ear.
s our threats were ignored, I fully support the decision made to close Heavy 
ighters Practice.


Angus MacKnochard Bagadur
NDA GDH
SCA
SS LXVIII, 

nerta er vald

________________________________
From: Ld.blackmoon <ld.blackmoon at cox.net>
To: The Barony of Northkeep <northkeep at lists.ansteorra.org>
Sent: Wednesday, October 5, 2011 3:44 PM
Subject: Re: [Northkeep] Fighter practice

greetings

ok, i'm guessing here, and am probably wrong, but from the posts, it sounds 
ike the people who were gaming last night didnt stay and clean . it is unkown 
f they created / left an exceptional mess .

my questions would be : a , what % of the armored fighters stay and clean every 
ime ?
b: what % of the gamers stay and clean every time ?
c: what % of the general populace ( grub and garb , socializing , etc. ) stay 
nd clean every time?
also,
on average which group does what % of the cleaning ? and what groups clean when 
he fighters are off to war , etc. ??
( quite often the people i remember doing the cleaning were the officers, ( 
ncluding the b&b  ) , and the family members of same .  but that could possibly 
e just crs speaking : /  i am an old fart after all  )

i try to keep my opinions to myself , ( unless ask ), but i am a very curious 
ype that likes to know the basics " who , what , when , where , and especially 
hy "  = )

Be Safe , Be Happy, Have Fun .
Arthur

knowing officers, and b &b will have things running smoothly in no time ; )


----- Original Message ----- From: <facon at cox.net>
To: <northkeep at lists.ansteorra.org>
Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2011 3:12 PM
Subject: Re: [Northkeep] Fighter practice


> I would like to know what happened, and am actually surprised that I have not 
lready been filled in.
> 
> Baron Facon du Pray
> Baron of Northkeep
> Lord of Chemin Noir
> 
> 
> On Wed, Oct 5, 2011 at 2:42 PM, Kevinkeary wrote:
> 
>> Does ANYONE know what happened?
>> 
>> Write me privately if you'd rather, or call Keigan at home, 918-266-6466.
>> 
>> Kevin
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: jon.d.eppler <jon.d.eppler at gmail.com>
>> To: The Barony of Northkeep <northkeep at lists.ansteorra.org>
>> Sent: Wed, Oct 5, 2011 2:03 pm
>> Subject: Re: [Northkeep] Fighter practice
>> 
>> 
>> I was not there and do not know what happened but hope whatever it is can be 
rted out in a productive manner.  err Johann von Aue
>> ent via BlackBerry by AT&T
>> -----Original Message-----
>> rom: Kevinkeary <kevinkeary at aol.com>
>> ender: northkeep-bounces+jon.d.eppler=gmail.com at lists.ansteorra.orgDate: 
ed, 5 ct 2011 14:56:15 o: <johnt9432 at yahoo.com>; <northkeep at lists.ansteorra.org>
>> eply-To: The Barony of Northkeep <northkeep at lists.ansteorra.org>
>> ubject: Re: [Northkeep] Fighter practice
>> 
>> hat happened? I was not in attendance, but when I am, I do participate in 
he leaning, as do my children.
>> If this is the will of the fighter community, so be it. We know we were 
here nly at your sufferance. On a night when there was to be no place for us, I 
lowed my concern for my wife's health to supersede my feelings of obligation o 
he community.
>> I HAVE gone and cleaned on nights when there was no fighter practice, 
ecause he majority of the heavy fighters were at Gulf War. Obviously, we didn't 
ame hen, either.
>> Peace,
>> evin
>> -----Original Message-----
>> rom: johnt9432 <johnt9432 at yahoo.com>
>> o: The Barony of Northkeep <northkeep at lists.ansteorra.org>
>> ent: Wed, Oct 5, 2011 9:44 am
>> ubject: [Northkeep] Fighter practice
>> 
>>    After the events of last night there will be no gaming allowed at fighter 
ctice. I stated that if you use the VFW you must help clean. I am not a baby 
ter. Everyone knows by now what needs to be done. If you don't know what to  it 
s your responsibility to ask. For those who did clean,  thank you.    Sarran
>>    Squire to Sir Ulf
>>    Knights marshal for Northkeep
>> ent from my BlackBerry® powered by Virgin Mobile.
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