17th century, not 7th century--was Re: SC - history of brandy

[david friedman]

At 12:10 AM -0500 3/7/00, Ian Gourdon wrote:

>" ... I got curious, and looked up "brandy" in OED....
>Interesting  stuff. The original term (dating from the 7th
>century) is brandwine. The formation is thus:  brandwine >
>brandewine > brandy-wine > brandee > brandy.
>    Our familiar form was in use as early as 1657, with the
>fuller form of brandwine retained for official use through
>the end of the 17th century.  Therefore, "aqua-vitae" is the
>older form (dating from the 5-7 centuries), and is
>originally an alchemical term, only taking on its beverage
>connotation shortly thereafter. "  Gwydion
>
>So, the OED suggests a much older appearance for Brandy than
>some other commentary. Often a good place to check.

A good place to check, but it gives you information on the earliest 
use of the word, and words sometimes change their meaning, so it may 
or may not refer to the same thing.

In this case, however, I think someone has made a typo--7th century 
for 17th century.
At least, the entry in my copy of the OED has no reference earlier 
than the 17th century. Of course, it's possible that Gwydion is 
quoting from a later edition, but that isn't my guess. For one thing, 
the OED gives the original as from Dutch. I don't think Dutch existed 
in the 7th century.

Do you have Gwydion's email address? It is worth checking--and, if it 
is a mistake, correcting it before it spreads farther.

I note that the OED is the only source quoted in the discussion from 
another list that you are reporting. Did Arundel say what his source 
was?

I'm copying him on this message, in the hope of finding out.

David/Cariadoc
http://www.best.com/~ddfr/