[Sca-cooks] tart crusts

[Daniel Myers]

On Monday, December 16, 2002, at 08:55 PM, Stefan li Rous wrote:

> Edouard Halidai commented:
>> An interesting side effect though gave extra value to the experiment.
>> During baking the crust pulled away from the edges of the pie plate,
>> and the crust was strong enough to allow the pie to be removed from
>> the
>> pan intact.  If I had used a tart pan and not had the (inedibly hard)
>> flange of crust around the edge of the pie, the result would probably
>> have looked very like the tarts I've seen in period paintings -
>> freestanding with an irregular edge (due to inconsistent shrinkage).
>>
>> I think I need to get a couple proper tart pans and make a few more
>> tarts.  If they work then I'll take pictures and post them to the web.
>
> Interesting. What does a "tart pan" look like? Is there any evidence
> that these were used prior to 1600 CE? Bascially, I'm wondering how
> the pie would differ if it was cooked on a flat try rather than in
> a pan. I thought medieval pies were cooked that way, rather than in
> a pan.

I wish I could remember the title of the painting or the artist.  No
tart pans or other dishes were present in the painting, only several
tarts being carried on a serving board by two men.  The tarts were
round with fairly straight sides, and filled approximately to the top
edge of the crust.  What makes me suspect that they were baked in a pan
was that they were quite uniform in shape and size, and the crusts
didn't appear to be all that thick.  That combined with the way the
custardes I made this weekend turned out suggests to me that they could
have been made in a similar way.

Yes, this is indeed just supposition on my part, but throughout the
fourteenth and fifteenth centuries pie makers in Europe made a
transition from the thick walled, inedible, free-standing pie crusts to
thin walled, short crust tarts cooked in pans.  I would be very
surprised if there weren't many intermediate forms.

By "tart pan" I mean a flat bottomed pan with short sides that are
steeply sloped or even vertical.  Most modern tart pans I've seen have
fluted sides, but I have no idea if that form dates back prior to 1600
CE.

As for whether tarts were cooked in pans rather than free standing on a
flat tray, there is evidence to show that it was done in some cases.

 From "Forme of Cury" (Curye on Inglish) - 14th C.
"172 Tartee." ... "and make a crust in a trap, & do (th)e fars (th)erin
...."
"173 Tart in ymbre day." ... "bake it in a trap, & serue it forth."
"174 Tart de Bry.  Take a crust ynch depe in a trap." ... "Do it in a
trap; bake it & serue it forth."
"178 Tartes of fysshe." ... "Make a crust in a trap as bifore, and bake
ith (th)erin, and serue it forth."
"179 Sambocade. Take and make a crust in a trap & take ...."

Modern pies can sometimes be removed from their pans and still keep
their shape - it depends a lot on the filling and how well cooked the
crust is.  If you cooked a quiche-like pie in a tart pan (or perhaps a
shallow cake pan) and did not use any shortening in the crust, you
should be able to remove the cooled pie from the pan and have it hold
its shape.  However, unlike a tart that was made without a pan, such a
tart would be able to have a crust of the same thickness as that in
modern pies, and the crust would be edible as well.

- Doc


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  Edouard Halidai  (Daniel Myers)
  http://www.medievalcookery.com/
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