[Sca-cooks] Pyes of Pares article author's comments

[Phil Anderson]

I forwarded the digests containing the discussion of Del's Pyes of 
Pares article to him and he sent back the reply below. He can be 
contacted at del at babel.com.au

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Yes, I'm the author of the article, despite the fact that the
magazine failed to spell my last name correctly.  It is in
fact "Elson".

I'm happy to discuss any issues with the article off list but
I don't really have the time to subscribe to this list.  I'm
on too many mailing lists already, I have a full time job and
a half, and trying to keep a kingdom together at the moment
as well.

To answer some specific questions:

* I was aware that there were no period recipes covering how
to make pastry for these "coffins", and have used the post-period
sources that I was able to trace back.  The article conjectures
that *should* pastry have been made in this way in period then
it *can be proven* to be an effective means of preservation.
Therefore it is reasonable to conjecture that these pies would
have been made in this way, based on both the literature and
scientific evidence presented.

* The "pies bought from a service station" were in fact plain
meat pies.  They were not kept refrigerated, and were just
stored in paper bags.  I don't believe that the difference
between the wooden bowl, cloth, and paper bags made a significant
difference to the experiment.  The reason that the service-
station pies were kept in their original packing was to remove
any doubt about introducing baccillus or fungi through handling.

The primary difference between the service station pies and
the pyes de pares was the pastry.  The service station pies
had a meat filling, but the pastry was a thin-walled flaky
pastry, with some gaps and somewhat ineffective seals.  It is
apparent that airborne baccilli or spores were able to enter
the pies through the walls and/or seals of the pastry.  Making
the pastry heavier, dryer, and of a different composition,
prevented that.

On camp, we keep our pyes in a wicker basket covered with a
dry cloth.  This is based on our understanding of the use
of wicker containers in field kitchens of the late 15th C,
based on woodcuts and artwork of the period.  The wooden
bowl and cloth reproduced that part of the experiment under
laboratory supervision as much as I was able to (I wasn't
able to find a small sized wicker basket in time).  Also
there appears to be some use of wooden boxes for food storage,
again based on iconographic evidence of the period, and it
appears that these boxes are not usually well sealed or
airtight.  Therefore it is my conjecture that the food stored
inside these boxes or baskets had the ability to withstand
attack by airborne pathogens.

* The pastry that I normally use to make the pyes de pares
is somewhat, although not excessively salted.  It is edible,
and quite tasty especially at a camping event where you tend
to get dehydrated and crave salt anyway.  I often make larger
coffins to store roasted or boiled and salted meats, and the
pastry that I use to act as a storage is very salty, rock
hard, and not particularly edible.

* I am unable to get a release for posting this article to
the florilegium without first a word with the magazine editor.
I will do that shortly.  I'm reasonably sure that he will
have no problems with that, perhaps after a suitable time
period, but I have to make the call first.

-- 
Del
aka Delbert von Strassburg
Lochac

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