[Sca-cooks] A good source? was "period spice containers/storage"
James Prescott
prescotj at telusplanet.net
Wed Jul 6 10:45:54 PDT 2011
I too am rather suspicious, so I've been googling.
There are certainly objects called "spice plates" in some
inventories and lists of items purchased. For example:
http://collections.vam.ac.uk/item/O78604/spice-plate-abraham-sacrificing-isaac/
http://collections.vam.ac.uk/item/O156626/tazza/?print=1
http://www.christies.com/LotFinder/lot_details.aspx?intObjectID=4446550
http://www.barleyhall.org.uk/JCollanInventory.asp
http://www.yorkarchaeology.co.uk/resources/AY2-2-bridgemasters.pdf
I have found a reference to a possible earlier source for the
story about handing around actual spices: "The Medieval English
Feast", by William Edward Mead, 1931 (reprinted 1967). I don't
have a copy, but if anyone has access to one could they check it,
probably page 77, and see what it says.
Also from
http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=75717
we have
"To serve the ladies Mary and Elizabeth with spices, wafers, and
wine: the lord Hastings to bear the cup to lady Mary, and the lord
Delaware that to lady Elizabeth; lord Dacres of the South to bear the
spice plates to both, lord Cobham the wafers, and lord Montagew to
uncover the spice plate."
Also from
http://books.google.com/books?id=r44plPoT3bIC
we have
"Apon Seynt Georges day or even
If it be a fasting day, than there is a voyde servid. And then a
gentleman ussher appoynt a lorde for the spice plate; a cuppberare
and a gentleman ussher to beare the bolles and bring them to the
cubberde. Then every one of the ordre in his degree cometh and
servith the king of the voyde and a gentilman ussher to see them that
shall beare the spice plate armed with the towelles abowt theire
[blank]. And the kinges spice plate to be covered, and one towell."
Neither of these says what was on the spice plate.
Thorvald
At 12:10 PM -0400 7/6/11, Johnna Holloway wrote:
> The source is 20 plus years old and it's also a translation so
> that might play into the accuracy.
> The original is titled Das Paradies, der Geschmack und die
> Vernunft. It came out in 1990.
>
> I am wondering if they confused spices with what were really spice
> confits or candied spices.
> Was the sugar part left out?
>
> Johnnae
>
> On Jul 6, 2011, at 10:22 AM, Daniel Myers wrote:
>
>>
>> I haven't read the book, but it disturbs me a bit to see the only
>> citation in a quote from a tertiary source being another tertiary
>> source. Unless Schivelbusch refers to a primary source for such
>> use of a "spice
>> platter", or unless you can find a primary or secondary source that
>> confirms Schivelbusch's assertion, then it should be treated as
>> conjecture.
>>
>> - Doc
>>
>>
>>> -------- Original Message --------
>>> From: Annofnite at aol.com
>>> snipped
>>> Tastes of Paradise: A Social History of Spices, Stimulants, and
>>> Intoxicants
>>> by Wolfgang Schivelbusch
>>> published by Vintage Books, A Division of Random House ISBN
>>> 0-679-74438-X
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