SR - Late Entry

Timothy A. McDaniel tmcd at
Fri Aug 6 11:57:56 PDT 1999

Something I forgot to mention in the procedural message -- I think
registerability is very important for our name candidates.  What's the
point of selecting a name and getting used to it if we can never
register it if we want?  I mentioned how we sent out names for
heraldic consultation.  If you have another idea for a name, would you
please contact me at tmcd at, or AElfwyn at jmcmaste at,
or Ansteorran heralds at heralds at, so we can forward it
for a quick check?  Would you please do this *before* you start
lobbying people to vote for it?

As for Lyonesse ... Richard R. Hershberger <rrhersh at> wrote,
> From the One True Encyclopedia (i.e. the 11th edition Britannica):
> "Lyonnesse, Lyonesse, Leonnoys or Leonais, a legendary country off
> the south coast of Cornwall, England.  Lyonnesse is the scene of
> many incidents in the Arthurian romances, and especially in the
> romances of Tristram and Iseult.  It also plays an important part in
> purely Cornish tradition and folklore, Early English chronicles,
> such as the 'Chronicon e chonicis' of Florence of Worcester, who
> died in 1118, described minutely and without a suggestion of
> disbelief the flourishing state of Lyonnesse, and its sudden
> disappearance beneath the sea.  The legend may be a greatly
> exaggerated version of some actual subsidence of inhabited land.
> There is also a very ancient local tradition, apparently independent
> of the story of Lyonnesse, that the Scilly Islands formed part of
> the Cornish mainland within historical times."

We protect from conflict famous real places.  For example, a group
can't register the Shire of Kent, or the Barony of France, or the
Burgh of Aachen.  We also protect from conflict famous fictional
places.  You can't register a Barony of Atlantis, a Principality of
Camelot, a Province of Valhalla, a Principality of Darkover, a Barony
of Tir na nOg, et cetera.

The usual standard of famousness in the SCA College of Arms is a name
having its own entry in one of a few general encyclopedias.

> Note that from a legalistic perspective, Lyonnesse has its own
> article in a general encyclopedia.  By even the most strict
> interpretation this is therefore protected [from conflict].

No Principality of Lyonesse, or House, or any other unmodified form,
is registerable.

Similarly, Cibola was nominated, but it was eliminated for the same
problem: it was a fabled land (somewhat more real than Lyonesse,
though) and had its own entry.  Nueva Cibola did make it onto the
ballot -- "New Cibola".  Because of the adjective, it's not a
conflict.  If someone knows what language "Lyonesse" might be
compatible with -- French, I suppose? -- you could similarly add a
translated version "New".  ("Nouveau Lyonesse", maybe?  Is Lyonesse
masculine or feminine, and does the adjective change?)  With English
references to it, I'd bet plain "New" would work.

(Because of the preference balloting, any existing ballots that have
"Lyonesse" aren't completely wasted: we'll just go to the next choice
on the list.)

Daniel de Lincolia
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Tim McDaniel is tmcd at; if that fail,
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