[Youth-combat] RE: [Elfsea] RE: [Steppes] Fwd:[Ansteorra]YouthfulCombata...
Trish Kvamme
ladyoftherose at hotmail.com
Thu Jan 13 09:11:26 PST 2005
I agree, thinking and mostly caring are what makes a persons mettle.
Because I asked the question doesn't mean I don't care or am cold to them, I
have 22 years in the SCA, was a Field Revenue Officer for the Internal
Revenue Service (used to dealing with angry people) and taught music
privatlely for years as well as alot of professional theatre and a alot of
other stage and music which you would get a giggle from, since you shared
your background with me I thought I would share mine with you, so you can
see me as a person and a bit more human as apposed to the text or the
amusing rumor one sad soul or another creates (laugh).
My issue is that I believe it should be in the parents hands to make the
decision. The analogy I use most is driving a car.
At 16 a child with her/his parents permission can drive a car, they turn the
corner and they are out of our sight.
At 16 with fighting, I can see him clearly because I have to be there, so
can everyone else, including other parents like you who care about our kids
and our community in the SCA.
We are not going to have a horde of kids coming to fight, this ruling is
only truly going to affect a very small portion of our population, but these
are kids we would probably have lost without it.
I 100 percent support the right of any parent who chooses to say no way to
their own kids on this, and and child who says this isnt for me. My only
real issues on this is why is all this still being debated when the crown
passed it some time ago, and it is agreed upon as well by their Heirs.
If there are people in this Kingdom who would turn their head and say not my
kid, not my problem, I dont want to know them. I do believe with all my
heart that MOST of the people who are playing a game recreating courtesy and
chivlary are far better than that, and just that some of you wrote tells me
that the caring I believe to be there is there.
Sir Alexis told me during our reign when we were discussing this same issue
that anyone can sue anyone at anytime for any reason. The real question
would be would the judge hear it.
If you see a youth fighter who is what you consider dangerous or in a
dangerous situation, grab me by the hand and drag me over and I will do
everything I can along with you to remedy the situation. Same for my
husband Duncan.
All I was treated to on the list was names I am not familiar with from the
fighting community making statements against this ruling for the kids.
Since they of course have the right which I fiercely protect to state their
opinion, I gave mine, as well as asked to hear from people who are fighters
with kids, because I think the perception of those who don't fight is alot
harsher than those who have fought.
I am one of those who if I am clearly considering refocusing my stance on
something, want to hear from those who are standing in the mud pile, not
outside of it with a towel, if that makes sense. It isn't disrepect towards
the people outside at all, it is that I am a learn by doing and touch and
not by reading type. I have to experience it myself in order to make sense
of it, it's just how I work, and I recognize that other people don't have to
jump in to understand the mud may be cold :)
On an off subject, it is nice to hear from you. We have alot of mutual
friends and have never had a chance to get to know each other at all. This
may ever be the longest exchange of words we have ever had lol. I am glad
to know there is people with concerns. I asked my questions on the list
because you would be amazed at how many people were expressing concerns who
have never fought nor have children. In coming to my conclusions, I really
wanted to hear from other parents and fighters.
So thank you again for writing, and I promise you if you show me something
or someone dangerous, I will be right there to help. Text is a cold medium
to get to know another person, I have a big sense of humor, which I also
hope comes through :)
Larissa
>From: DonnelShaw at aol.com
>To: steppes at ansteorra.org
>Subject: Re: [Youth-combat] RE: [Elfsea] RE: [Steppes]
>Fwd:[Ansteorra]YouthfulCombata...
>Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2005 23:29:12 EST
>
>
>Your Grace,
>Of the two previous posts and including mine we are all active members of
>the Youth Combat Community for the last three to four years.
>
> All of us have teenaged children who fight.
>
>Two of us are teachers and one is not.
>
>Two of us have been in for 20 plus years.
>
>Two of us have fought heavy.
>
>One has been a marshall and in the middle of things for years.
>
>One is one of my best friends and the other is my right hand man in youth
>combat.
>
>We don't always agree on everything but the bottom line is we want the best
>for the children. If that means being brave to state our support for the
>new purposed rule change or concern for the health and welfare for the
>child
>and SCA that could be caused by the new rule change. I am glad to hear it.
> We
>all have different perspective and experiences. It does not make one
>better
>than the other but we must respect each others opinions.
>
>Personally, I would rather have someone out there saying. "I am worried
>that
>(___ activity) might harm a child. Let's look at it and make sure
>everything
>is safe for your child as well as mine." Than "It's not my child." And not
>worry about it. They might come up with a good point. I thank those that
>are
>concerned and worried and have voiced their opinion. Thinking and caring
>for
>others is an honorable trait.
>
>Donnel
>
>
>In a message dated 1/12/2005 12:07:22 PM Central Standard Time,
>ladyoftherose at hotmail.com writes:
>
>Not to hurt anyone's feelings in any way regarding their opinion, but I am
>mildly curious as to the following.
>
>1. How many people who are adverse to these teens fighting ever fought
>heavy weapons/chivarlic combat?
>
>2. Of those who have, how many actually fought in a war?
>
>3. And of those who disagree, how many actually have children or teenaged
>children?
>
>4. How many of them have fought in an acutal battle in a shield wall or
>charge?
>
>Just curious.
>
>Larissa
>
> >From: Steppes Seneschal <steppes.seneschal at gmail.com>
> >Reply-To: Steppes Seneschal <steppes.seneschal at gmail.com>,
>"Barony
> >of Steppes - SCA, Inc." <steppes at ansteorra.org>
> >To: "Barony of Steppes - SCA, Inc." <steppes at ansteorra.org>
> >CC: dukepmg at aol.com, youth-combat at ansteorra.org, elfsea at ansteorra.org
> >Subject: Re: [Youth-combat] RE: [Elfsea] RE: [Steppes] Fwd:
> >[Ansteorra]YouthfulCombatants
> >Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2005 01:06:58 -0600
> >
> >I agree with you completely.
> >
> >
> >On Tue, 11 Jan 2005 21:48:02 -0600, Michael of Langley
> ><michaeloflangley at hotmail.com> wrote:
> > > To all concerned,
> > >
> > > My concern is that during a melee, such as Gulf Wars, the younger
> >fighters
> > > will be indistinguishable from older more seasoned fighters. At Gulf
> >Wars
> > > last year, during the spear tournament, an Ansteorran combatant had
>his
> > > chinstrap broken and the helmet hit him in his face when he took a
>heavy
> > > spear thrust. This was not in a grand melee, but a two against two
> >spear
> > > tournament. Our KING took the blow well...
> > >
> > > Now, lets think about a 16 year old, who is still growing, taking a
>face
> > > shot from a fiberglass spear. Unfortunately, our Earl Marshall will
>not
> >be
> > > there to make sure that the fighters are going to take it easy on
>them
> >and
> > > not bruise them too much. The younger fighters, still maturing, will
>be
> >at
> > > the mercy of the opposing force - I stress the "still maturing"
>part.
> > >
> > > We wear pads now and have parents attend the tournaments for a two
>fold
> > > reason, to avoid unnecessary injuries and law suits and to get the
> >parents
> > > more involved with their youth combatants. A lawsuit can be placed
> >against
> > > anyone for any reason - waiver or not (and while it may not stand up
>in
> > > court, it must still be defended against). Is it worth it? I can
>hear
> >it
> > > now when the first serious injury occurs - "You said he was ready and
> >that
> > > big guy just hit him way to hard!!! Who is going to pay all these
>doctor
> > > bills! Why didn't someone stop him! I would have stopped him if I was
> >here
> > > watching (but because I was on merchants row because I'm not REQUIRED
>to
> >be
> > > here - I was off shopping for my wife/husband)."
> > >
> > > Whether we want to acknowledge it or not, we have fighters with
> >prejudices -
> > > "I'm gonna smack every (girl/Saracen/crusader/guy/archer/whatever) as
> >hard
> > > as I can when I see them, because they shouldn't be on the field".
> >After
> > > the blow is thrown, "Oh, I'm so sorry - I didn't mean to hit you that
> >hard!"
> > > rarely makes up for it. Yes, we are always chivalrous and say "Its
>ok -
> >no
> > > problem - groan..." but inside, we're secretly hoping they get
>creamed
> >on
> > > the field and we get to see it (be honest).
> > >
> > > What will we say when a 16 year old is carried off with broken ribs,
>or
> >a
> > > ruptured spleen from too hard of a thrust? "Oh, sorry kid, that's
>life -
> >can
> > > we get a 'Lay on' here?"
> > >
> > > My SINCERE hope is that one of our youth fighters NEVER has anything
> >like
> > > this happen to them. This may ruffle a few feathers, but the youth
> >fighters
> > > are worth it. They will be 18 soon enough, after all, its only 730
> >days...
> > >
> > > "...Faith is daring the soul to believe what the eyes cannot see..."
> > >
> > > Lord Michael of Langley
> > > Squire to Sir Corwin von Xanten and Sir Anton Qwith
> > > Southern Regional Youth Marshal
> > >
> > > >From: "Vicki Marsh" <xaraxene at comcast.net>
> > > >Reply-To: Youth Combat in Ansteorra <youth-combat at ansteorra.org>
> > > >To: "Barony of Elfsea" <elfsea at ansteorra.org>,
><steppes at ansteorra.org>,
> > > > <youth-combat at ansteorra.org>
> > > >CC: dukepmg at aol.com
> > > >Subject: [Youth-combat] RE: [Elfsea] RE: [Steppes] Fwd: [Ansteorra]
> > > >YouthfulCombatants
> > > >Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2004 18:00:55 -0600
> > > >
> > > >Xene here:
> > > >
> > > >I was also in martial arts at the age of 16. Of course, this was a
>long
> > > >time
> > > >ago, in the 1970's, but we fought without pads. My parents didn't
>have
> >to
> > > >stay around to watch, even at the tournaments. In practice, I
>sparred
> > > >adults, but only the ones that the instructor knew had the ability
>to
> >spar
> > > >with me without hurting me badly. I would get bruises, but nothing
> >major.
> > > >The only injury I got was at a tournament from another student that
>was
> >in
> > > >my division. I got smacked in the nose pretty good and it taught me
>to
> >keep
> > > >my guard up. Did my father sue anyone? No. It was my fault for
> >dropping my
> > > >guard:)
> > > >As I improved in fighting, the intensity and speed was kicked up a
> >notch,
> > > >because the instructor knew I could handle it.
> > > >
> > > >16 and 17 year olds vary in size and maturity. Some of them are
>adult
> > > >sized,
> > > >some are not. Some have good judgement and some don't. They can
> >legally
> > > >drive on the streets, once they get get their training and license,
>but
> > > >they
> > > >don't get to jump in all at once. It requires in-classroom training,
> > > >behind-the-wheel training, 6 months with an instructional permit
>(and
> > > >driving with someone 21 yrs or older in the car). They then have
> >another 6
> > > >months with a provisional license. See
> > >
> >
> >www.txdps.state.tx.us/administration/driver_licensing_control/graduateddrive
> > > >r.htm
> > > >Oklahoma also has the GDL (graduated Driver's license) See:
> > > >http://www.dps.state.ok.us/dls/gdl.htm
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >I figure if the procedure of increasing responsibility and risk is
>good
> > > >enough for the States of Texas and Oklahoma, it's good enough for
> > > >Ansteorra.
> > > >
> > > >Under the new proposed rules, as I understand it, *I* can decide
> >whether or
> > > >not my son is ready or not. Then, the Kingdom Earl Marshal will
>provide
>
> >an
> > > >impartial decision as to whether or not my son is fit and mature
>enough
> >to
> > > >fight with adults.
> > > >That is reasonable.
> > > >
> > > >My only concern is that if we have a EM who doesn't travel enough,
>or
> > > >parents who aren't able to travel to the EM, they won't be able to
>have
>
> >the
> > > >requisite approval. Unfortunately, we have had kingdom officers who
> > > >virtually fell off the face of the earth during their tenure. If the
> >power
> > > >of final approval only rests in one person's hands, it can become a
> > > >bottleneck, or a political issue.
> > > >
> > > >Baroness Xene Theriane, OL, OP
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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