ANST - On-line Ansteorra : Comments and rebuttal...

[Wayne / Duncan]

If I am not mistaken, at the red tape meeting someone (I think it was Lord
Corwin MagEoin) offered to donate a server. That offer was turned away, the
preference being to purchase a new server, which has a warranty and on-site
support. Here is a case of a donation being turned away, and instead a hat
being passed. Someone please correct me if I am wrong, but I thought this
fact was relevant to the argument at hand.

Duncan Hepburn
Barony of The Steppes, Ansteorra

-----Original Message-----
From: Lorraine and/or Kief <deer_kief at hotmail.com>
To: ansteorra at Ansteorra.ORG <ansteorra at Ansteorra.ORG>
Cc: coastal at Ansteorra.ORG <coastal at Ansteorra.ORG>; southern at Ansteorra.ORG
<southern at Ansteorra.ORG>; central at Ansteorra.ORG <central at Ansteorra.ORG>;
northern at Ansteorra.ORG <northern at Ansteorra.ORG>; western at Ansteorra.ORG
<western at Ansteorra.ORG>
Date: Tuesday, April 27, 1999 2:08 AM
Subject: Re: ANST - On-line Ansteorra : Comments and rebuttal...


>Heilsa Lionardo Acquistapace...and all Ansteorrans Good and True...
>
>You wrote these words:
>
>>I would concur that his business plan for this project is
>>sound and well reasoned. I fully support our going through with this
>plan.
>
>Excellent...then why are you trying to sabotage donations...?!
>
>>I do have one concern, however, that is not for Pug, but for each of
>you,
>>gentle readers. As Pug mentioned a hat was passed at the Red Tape
>event
>>where this proposal was first brought to light. $300 dollars was
>raised from
>>the pockets of those present, with a few notable exceptions. It's the
>>exception I want to talk about. Some of us did not contribute
>because we
>>have already contributed for just this purpose. I contribute every
>time I
>>attend a Kingdom level event (at least 30% of the profit from those
>events
>>goes to the Kingdom) and Gulf Wars. I have contributed through the
>years to
>>various and sundry "fund-raisers", all without really looking
>closely at our
>>fair Kingdom's finances. Let me tell you, friends, our finances
>appear to be
>>quite healthy, despite recent problems in ensuring we have funds
>well in
>>hand.
>
>Yep...our finances appear quite healthy.......... However, I will
>take issue with Lord Lionardo's reasoning... We all "contribute" to
>the Kingdom coffers with our participation and, some of us, through
>various fund-raisers.... So what? The "fund-raisers" are used for
>specific funding... Each one for special needs...so...those funds are
>effectively not in the Kingdom's "General coffers"... The, "at least
>30%" of the gate at Kingdom events goes to various projects and
>needed improvments in the Kingdom. To wit:
>Printing of Special Editions of the Black Star - "A&S Issue"
>Printing of the O.P....of the Marshalate Rules...of the other various
>Handbooks....Treasurers...Seneschal...etcetcetc......
>As well, the Crown's pittance of a travel fund....
>Lionardo your "contribution" is also money taken away from the local
>group's general coffers for the good of the Kingdom... As such it is
>not a "contribution" at all but just part of the site fee....
>
>You are whining......
>
>>We could have paid for this directly from Kingdom funds, and the vast
>>majority present at the Red Tape event seemed quite happy to agree
>with such
>>a decision, had it been made. Instead a few swayed the process over
>to
>>donation stating reasons such as "I don't use a computer," or"I'm
>not a
>>Kingdom Officer, so how would Ansteorra.Org benefit me at all? I
>don't want
>>my Kingdom to spend funds on that which I would not use!" To this I
>say, I
>>do not use the thrones, or the pillows for our crown, yet we agree
>it is
>>worthwhile to purchase these things, if only for ambiance. Yet we
>can see
>>more tangible results in having a place for new members to contact
>us and
>>find out more about our fair Kingdom through this means alone. The
>sharing
>>of information on the mailing lists from this server is simply
>phenomenal
>>and those who are not on this medium benefit greatly because they
>have
>>friends and teachers who use it to garner more knowledge to share
>with
>>everyone.
>
>You state that, "a few swayed the process over to donation stating
>reasons such as "I don't use a computer," or"I'm not a Kingdom
>Officer, so how would Ansteorra.Org benefit me at all? I don't want
>my Kingdom to spend funds on that which I would not use!"...".
>
>Poppycock...the consensus was such that donations would be used in
>conjunction with Kingdom funding for the project. And, if perchance
>the Kingdom rejected the project, the funds collected would be placed
>into the Kingdom general coffers. The good folk that donated money to
>the project did so out of a sense of love for Ansteorra...not a sense
>of guilt over those few that would not benefit from the project. Your
>argument could be used to deny funding for Equestrian
>activities ...'cause I don't ride a horse...don't use any of MY Money
>to fund it........
>
>Many of the objects that you mentioned in the preceeding paragraph as
>purchases were, in fact, donated to the Kingdom by folks that care
>about the Kingdom...just like the monetary donations that were freely
>given at the RT event for the computer project.
>
>>It is also said that we would not wish to affect the finances now
>while we
>>still have much to pay for on ATYC (Ansteorra's Thirtieth Year
>Celebration),
>>including over $1,000 on site tokens alone! $1,000 spent on that
>which will
>>allow us to further our education and knowledge and membership seems
>to me
>>to be far better spent than on a dangly I might wear for a couple of
>days
>>and benefits no-one who is not attending the event. (I do not
>believe that
>>not having a token would in any way affect our ability to make a
>profit on
>>ATYC, thank you very much.) Yes, we should wait to see that we will
>be
>>making a comfortable profit on ATYC such as the use of $2,000 would
>not
>>cause us a burden, but is waiting for an extra month before deciding
>to make
>>such a purchase such an ordeal? None of those involved seem to mind
>waiting
>>to get this system up and running.
>
>You obviously think that $1,000 is a lot of money..... given the fact
>that there will be over 1,000 people at Ansteorra' _Twentieth_ Year
>Celebration that works out to be less than a buck per attendee...
>
>As well, the specific funds in the Kingdom coffers are not all
>available for use... Well over half the funds are dedicated money set
>aside for specific offices and projects...
>
>I personally would not mind seeing the computer project funded
>totally by donations from the populace and using not one penny of
>Kingdom funding for the purchase... Given the fact that there are
>many involved with the project that have been and will be donating
>time, energy, and their own money can we as the good subjects of the
>Crown of Ansteorra do less...?
>
>>Why burden the populace with yet another unneeded fund raiser? Why
>not use
>>Kingdom funds after ATYC. Isn't this project exactly the kind of
>thing our
>>Kingdom funds should be used for? I say we should let our voices be
>heard
>>and write our Kingdom Seneschal with our thoughts on this subject,
>either
>>for or against using Kingdom funds.
>
>You got it...! My voice is being heard... Loud and clear. I have not
>yet seen an "un-needed fund raiser". Yours is a specious argument. If
>YOU do not want to contribute actual funding to the project YOU don't
>have to. Certainly this project is what Kingdom funds are designed
>for... Yet, why not let those folks that want to donate to the
>project have the joy of doing so...? If we can save the Kingdom money
>on this and come out of it with an enhanced electronic presence on
>the Web, great...! Besides...this donated money enables the Kingdom
>to do two "enhancement" projects instead of one... If indeed the
>computer project is paid for by donations alone...why, then we, as a
>Kingdom, can fund a new educational or PR project that will bring in
>even more new members........
>
>>With great sincerity,
>>
>>(Lionardo Acquistapace, Bjornsborg)
>
>Waes Thu Hael kinfolk...
>Kief
>"Better the Hammer than the nail..."
>
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