ANST - Re: Scrolls & Charters - Thank you

[Dr Tiomoid of Angle]

--- Karie Mitchell <allessandre at hotmail.com> wrote:

> > But the SCA environment is more complicated. Awards aren't just 
> > "SCA legal documents", they're also (after a fashion) prizes 
> > to celebrate achievement, and people want them to look nice. 
> > Hence the urge, which is perfectly natural, to add as much 
> embellishment as practicable.
> 
> I understand this point and I think this is where I agree with you. 
> I suggest that since they are "SCA"-oriented, rather than "a specific
> culture"-oriented, they might be a more "generic" language.  We are
> recognizing achievements in the SCA and not a victory over the
> Saxons at Hastings.

I certainly agree, and feel that the forms our kingdoms follow (not
just in awards but in all aspects of "official" life) ought to be
modelled on the epicenter of the SCA's re-creation, the Anglo/French
High Middle Ages. (For example, that's the core of our heraldic
practice.) Others disagree, of course, and this is an area in which
there needs to be a lot of discussion in which everyone concerned can
work out a consensus regarding what ought to be "standardized" and what
is available for "customization". Hence the twofold nature of my
proposal -- on the one hand, the Kingdom-centric aspects can be
standardized, and on the other, the person-centric aspects can be
customized, and that ought to make the maximum number of people happy.

> > And, because the SCA millieu covers such a broad geographic and
> > temporal range, people have an (equally natural) desire to have
> > something that is congruent with their personal interests -- a
> > Norse persona is a Norse persona for a reason, and such a person
> > would obviously be more pleased with something in Norse runes 
> > than in Latin miniscule.
> 
> And writing a document is far easier (no matter what the script) than
> illuminating it and writing it.

Well, actually, the choice is between writing a document in calligraphy
versus painting a document that is already lettered and lined, but I
think that the differences are, if not as great, certainly sufficient
to favor the former over the latter.

> But do most scribes prefer calligraphy or do they prefer
> illumination?

I suspect that some prefer one and some prefer the other and some don't
have a preference. The situation appears to be that, although it is
sometimes difficult, we are succeeding in getting enough people to
paint the pre-printed forms we now use. The question is whether it
would be easier (or at least as easy) to get enough calligraphers to do
the "Court" documents. That is a question for which there seems to be
only anecdote and speculation. We need more data.

> I agree that people would like to have a "prize", however I think
> there are better ways to do that.  I have often thought, especially 
> after having heard Mistress Serena rant, that I would like a 
> scroll done authentically, in black and red, as most legal 
> documents were.  Then I would request a page  done in the manner 
> of a "book of prayer", (like the Duc du Berry  illuminations?) 
> with a prayer on one side and the picture on the other, 
> commemorating the event of my elevation (to whatever level).

That would certainly be my preference, and I applaud your approach.
However, as has been pointed out by Mistress Rose and others, not
everybody prefers that approach, and we need to accommodate what the
generality of the people and the officers involved want, rather than
attempt to decide The Way Things Ought To Be and attempt to impose that
on everybody. The latter course, while traditional in the SCA, seldom
works satisfactorily.

> Another point is that we don't take the time to do insignia properly.
> So much could be done with that aspect as well.  Most of the time
> it's hung around our necks until we bend over from the weight, or 
> choke!  I think it would be wonderful if people (including me) could
> find other ways of displaying our rank.

Well, a lot of people in the SCA seem determined to wear ever trinket
they've ever been given for any purpose, and that's part of the
problem. There's no need to wear a Sable Crane if you've got a Star of
Merit, nor is there any need to wear a Sable Thistle if you've got an
Iris. (Actually, there's no need to wear a Star of Merit if you've got
a Pelican, either, although the fact that the insignia occupy different
parts of the body ameliorates that somewhat -- the only reason I wear
my Star of Merit is because it's embroidered on my sleeve.)

Consider the way modern royalty wear the many decorations to which
they're entitled: Typically they wear only a few, with the emphasis on
whatever is expecially relevant at the time. If I were asked to help
judge an arts competition, for example, I'd probably wear my Iris even
thought I typically don't, because it would be especially relevant.

> > So: I suggest that an appropriate resolution would involve a
> > two-part system. One part would be geared toward what happens 
> > in court, the other part toward what hangs on the recipient's 
> > wall.

> I agree with this point.  Would you change the wording of the text?

Possibly, possibly not. One of the advantages would be that each text
could be optimized for the purpose it serves. This is far more flexible
than the current system. I forsee the Court text being hammered out by
a working group consisting of Their Majesties, Royal Peers, ruling
nobles, and relevant Kingdom officers, since they're the ones most
familiar with what is being accomplished in Court. The other side would
probably be based on certain standards but more tailor-made to the
persona and preferences of the recipient, as well as the capabilities
of the scribe. 

> I like your ideas and I hope that you might be able to use some of
> my own.  I am very interested in helping this change come about.  
> I too would like to see more authentic charters and scrolls being
> used.  I know that my handwriting is not very good, but are there
> other ways I might be able to assist?

Anyone who participates in the discussion is a help, and the more ideas
we have to discuss the better the chance we have of finding those that
everybody likes.


Fra Tadhg Liath OFT
The Grumpiest Pelican
SCITIS IMPLETI * NOSCE IGNOTIS
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