[Ansteorra] Cost of Time
Angela Scott
silvrbnd at yahoo.com
Mon Jul 27 06:52:02 PDT 2009
As a person who can berly sew a hem in I am completly astounded by the talents of our artisans and wish I could do that. But knowing I can't I gladly shell out what money I have at the time for their one of a kind items. I am still in love with a dress that I ordered at Gothic a couple years ago that I know took her time to make because of my odd porportions in the shoulders. So thanks to all those who can and do create for the poor sods like me that would rather by and get the quality than spend hours trying to make something only to find you sewed a sleeve in inside out and on the wrong arm (yes I really did this).
Respectfully,
Lady Juliana Hughes
--- On Fri, 7/24/09, ansteorra-request at lists.ansteorra.org <ansteorra-request at lists.ansteorra.org> wrote:
From: ansteorra-request at lists.ansteorra.org <ansteorra-request at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: Ansteorra Digest, Vol 39, Issue 23
To: ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
Date: Friday, July 24, 2009, 2:00 PM
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Today's Topics:
1. medieval soldiers' surnames (Coblaith Muimnech)
2. Re: Agincourt war records (Hillary Greenslade)
3. The Cost of Time (Jean Paul de Sens)
4. Re: The Cost of Time (Stephanie Smith)
5. Re: The Cost of Time (Colin MacNachtan)
6. Re: The Cost of Time (Leslie Snipes)
7. Re: The Cost of Time (julie mcknight)
8. ISO H.L.Emma (Charles ? Floinn)
9. Re: ISO H.L.Emma (Jennifer Smith)
10. Re: ISO H.L.Emma (Charles ? Floinn)
11. Re: The Cost of Time (Lisa Sawyer)
12. Re: Agincourt war records (Charles ? Floinn)
13. Re: The Cost of Time (Kaitlan Roisendubh)
14. Re: The Cost of Time (love at roseandchad.net)
15. Re: Lost Pennsic Luggage, was The Cost of Time (Leslie Snipes)
16. Re: Agincourt war records (John Atkinson)
17. Re: The Cost of Time (Jennifer Jackson)
18. Re: slightly OT: big artist competition (Betsy Marshall)
19. ISO Sir Rhodri & Sir William of Weir (Rebecca Bevel)
20. Re: ISO Sir Rhodri & Sir William of Weir (Paul Foster)
21. Re: The Cost of Time (HE Chiang)
22. Re: The Cost of Time (William Meriic)
23. Re: The Cost of Time (Bree Flowers)
24. Last fighter cards until after Pennsic-- (Kory-Kajira Lewis)
25. HERALDIC HELP NEEDED (Alice Morrow Harris)
26. Re: The Cost of Time (Stefan li Rous)
27. Re: HERALDIC HELP NEEDED (Elec inghean She?in)
28. Blowing Bubbles at Pennsic (Sca Godmother)
29. Re: Blowing Bubbles at Pennsic (a period game suggestion).
(deboramarzec at aol.com)
30. Re: Fw: Anyone Missing a Shield? (willowdewisp at juno.com)
31. Re: Blowing Bubbles at Pennsic (a period game suggestion).
(Tina Michael)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 14:25:51 -0500
From: Coblaith Muimnech <Coblaith at sbcglobal.net>
Subject: [Ansteorra] medieval soldiers' surnames
To: "Inc. Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA" <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID: <9B2A2256-C5DA-40F5-A346-8008D0972A61 at sbcglobal.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed
We have over the last couple of days discussed the database for the
The Soldier in Later Medieval England project, at <http://
www.icmacentre.ac.uk/soldier/database/index.php>, on this list, in
threads with the subject lines "check this out", "here is the web
site", "100 Years War soldier list", and "Agincourt war records".
Questions were raised as to whether some or all of the surnames in
the database might have been normalized, due to an ambiguous
statement on the website. So I used the "for more information
contact" link at the bottom of the index page to ask for
clarification. Dr. Adrian Bell, Senior Lecturer in the History of
Finance and Director of Teaching and Learning at the ICMA Centre,
answered my inquiry, confirming that while the given names have been
normalized, the surnames are unaltered.
Coblaith Muimnech
<mailto:Coblaith at sbcglobal.net>
<http://coblaith.net>
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 13:03:17 -0700 (PDT)
From: Hillary Greenslade <hillaryrg at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] Agincourt war records
To: ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
Message-ID: <390888.5210.qm at web110308.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Here they are again...
A few websites to check out from a new online database created for the Agincourt war records:
(collected from several posts off the Ansteorran lists)
News articles:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/8160081.stm
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1201096/Did-ancestors-fight-Agincourt-War-records-250-000-medieval-soldiers-online.html
Website with database:
http://www.icmacentre.ac.uk/soldier/database/
Wonder if the SCA could use this database as source material for names study and SCA name registry?
Enjoy the reading, Hillary / Ansteorra
Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 17:50:48 -0500
From: "Maleah" <baroness_maleah at cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] Agincourt war records
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Hillary,
? ? I did not see a website listed for the records. Any clue where to find
them??
Maleah
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 15:44:32 -0500
From: Jean Paul de Sens <jeanpauldesens at gmail.com>
Subject: [Ansteorra] The Cost of Time
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID:
<2e756a790907231344n4d2a8e57w715913d26ae70b94 at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
The recent shield discussion, and the responses to the costs, has just
reinforced my belief that we (the SCA) and society in general have forgot
how much it costs to do *one* of an object.
Case in point, that shield probably has around $40-$50 of materials (glue,
wood, hose, maybe hidden u-channel, rope, bolts, nuts,primer, paint, finish
coat).
It also has (if I had to bet) around 20 hours of labor (cut shield,
laminate, sand, prime, outline pattern, paint, clear coat).
So if I were to pay some guy $10 per hour to do this, it would cost me
around $250 to do this shield.
If I had to run a business doing this, where I had to pay for construction
space, taxes, perhaps even health, insurance, etc etc, well, that $10 per
hour worker will cost around $25/hour.
Now the cost of that custom shield goes to $550.
Often, I feel that we in the SCA don't appreciate the monetary value of the
art works that people make. The scrolls on our walls, the clothes, the
weapons, shields, what have you, are custom made works of art, and when we
dismiss the price on something as "too high" and "not worth that" we
diminish the effort of the artist.
I don't know who made that shield. I know that someone probably put a lot
of energy, money, and effort into it, and might be a bit offended at some of
the comments made.
I know of many generous artisans in our kingdom and our game, who donate
work and craft and art so selflessly that is astounds me. Let us make sure
that we keep in mind both the spiritual and the monetary value of their
work, and thank them accordingly.
My apologies for rambling, but this issue always bothers me a bit.
JP
Qui mieux fait, mieux vault.
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 16:01:38 -0500
From: Stephanie Smith <lambdakennels1 at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] The Cost of Time
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID:
<de3d1fd70907231401l2ae65b8dw5c97c70488822e07 at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Just when I dismiss the Knights as cloddish stick jockeys, one astounds me.
Sir JP is right, people do tend to discount the labor involved in the things
we make. It is all well and good to look at something and say, "I can make
that. Why should I pay $X for it?" Well, because you DIDN'T make it. You
don't have time to make it even though you know how to do it. Sometimes the
smallest things, the ones everyone goes, "Oh, that is just a pendant" are
the hardest to make. If priced fairly, to account for the degree of
difficulty as well as the time and materials, no one could possibly afford
them. Remember that next time you dismiss the work of an artisan in a
merchan'ts booth as "something I could do." Particularly within their
hearing.
Stephanie
--
Stephanie S Smith, Ph.D.
Hunt County, Texas, USA
www.lambdafarm.mysite.com
Owned by a Standard Poodle and an Australian Cattle Dog
On Thu, Jul 23, 2009 at 3:44 PM, Jean Paul de Sens <jeanpauldesens at gmail.com
> wrote:
> The recent shield discussion, and the responses to the costs, has just
> reinforced my belief that we (the SCA) and society in general have forgot
> how much it costs to do *one* of an object.
> Case in point, that shield probably has around $40-$50 of materials (glue,
> wood, hose, maybe hidden u-channel, rope, bolts, nuts,primer, paint, finish
> coat).
> It also has (if I had to bet) around 20 hours of labor (cut shield,
> laminate, sand, prime, outline pattern, paint, clear coat).
>
> So if I were to pay some guy $10 per hour to do this, it would cost me
> around $250 to do this shield.
>
> If I had to run a business doing this, where I had to pay for construction
> space, taxes, perhaps even health, insurance, etc etc, well, that $10 per
> hour worker will cost around $25/hour.
>
> Now the cost of that custom shield goes to $550.
>
> Often, I feel that we in the SCA don't appreciate the monetary value of the
> art works that people make. The scrolls on our walls, the clothes, the
> weapons, shields, what have you, are custom made works of art, and when we
> dismiss the price on something as "too high" and "not worth that" we
> diminish the effort of the artist.
>
> I don't know who made that shield. I know that someone probably put a lot
> of energy, money, and effort into it, and might be a bit offended at some
> of
> the comments made.
>
> I know of many generous artisans in our kingdom and our game, who donate
> work and craft and art so selflessly that is astounds me. Let us make sure
> that we keep in mind both the spiritual and the monetary value of their
> work, and thank them accordingly.
>
> My apologies for rambling, but this issue always bothers me a bit.
>
> JP
>
> Qui mieux fait, mieux vault.
> _______________________________________________
> Ansteorra mailing list
> Ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
> http://lists.ansteorra.org/listinfo.cgi/ansteorra-ansteorra.org
>
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 16:06:26 -0500
From: Colin MacNachtan <colin at mccr.org>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] The Cost of Time
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID: <200907231606.32508.colin at mccr.org>
Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
On Thursday 23 July 2009, Stephanie Smith wrote:
> Just when I dismiss the Knights as cloddish stick jockeys, one astounds me.
> Sir JP is right, people do tend to discount the labor involved in the
> things we make. It is all well and good to look at something and say, "I
> can make that. Why should I pay $X for it?" Well, because you DIDN'T make
> it. You don't have time to make it even though you know how to do it.
> Sometimes the smallest things, the ones everyone goes, "Oh, that is just a
> pendant" are the hardest to make. If priced fairly, to account for the
> degree of difficulty as well as the time and materials, no one could
> possibly afford them. Remember that next time you dismiss the work of an
> artisan in a merchan'ts booth as "something I could do." Particularly
> within their hearing.
One of the best signs I've seen was at a booth at (I think) Pennsic that said
"Yes, you could make this stuff. But you know you won't."
Colin MacNachtan
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 14:13:43 -0700 (PDT)
From: Leslie Snipes <lesdsnipes at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] The Cost of Time
To: " Inc.Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA" <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID: <32207.78541.qm at web35504.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
I agree with you both wholeheartedly and that the talented artisans should be roundly praised and much more frequently.? I was always cognizant that some of the artisans, volunteers, and participants,?have professional lives outside the SCA so the "wages" given up in order to do SCA work of any kind might easily be far more than $25/hour.? On the other hand, do we really think the eBay guy paid for the shield and helm he's selling?? I took the comments to imply we didn't (and I don't think he paid much, if anything, for the items since he didn't seem to know what they are) and that the prices were outrageous in that context.
?
Pandora
Leslie S. 713-795-0811
--- On Thu, 7/23/09, Stephanie Smith <lambdakennels1 at gmail.com> wrote:
From: Stephanie Smith <lambdakennels1 at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] The Cost of Time
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Date: Thursday, July 23, 2009, 4:01 PM
Just when I dismiss the Knights as cloddish stick jockeys, one astounds me.
Sir JP is right, people do tend to discount the labor involved in the things
we make.? It is all well and good to look at something and say, "I can make
that.? Why should I pay $X for it?"? Well, because you DIDN'T make it.? You
don't have time to make it even though you know how to do it.? Sometimes the
smallest things, the ones everyone goes, "Oh, that is just a pendant" are
the hardest to make.? If priced fairly, to account for the degree of
difficulty as well as the time and materials, no one could possibly afford
them.? Remember that next time you dismiss the work of an artisan in a
merchan'ts booth as "something I could do."? Particularly within their
hearing.
Stephanie
--
Stephanie S Smith, Ph.D.
Hunt County, Texas, USA
www.lambdafarm.mysite.com
Owned by a Standard Poodle and an Australian Cattle Dog
On Thu, Jul 23, 2009 at 3:44 PM, Jean Paul de Sens <jeanpauldesens at gmail.com
> wrote:
> The recent shield discussion, and the responses to the costs, has just
> reinforced my belief that we (the SCA) and society in general have forgot
> how much it costs to do *one* of an object.
> Case in point, that shield probably has around $40-$50 of materials (glue,
> wood, hose, maybe hidden u-channel, rope, bolts, nuts,primer, paint, finish
> coat).
> It also has (if I had to bet) around 20 hours of labor (cut shield,
> laminate, sand, prime, outline pattern, paint, clear coat).
>
> So if I were to pay some guy $10 per hour to do this, it would cost me
> around $250 to do this shield.
>
> If I had to run a business doing this, where I had to pay for construction
> space, taxes, perhaps even health, insurance, etc etc, well, that $10 per
> hour worker will cost around $25/hour.
>
> Now the cost of that custom shield goes to $550.
>
> Often, I feel that we in the SCA don't appreciate the monetary value of the
> art works that people make.? The scrolls on our walls, the clothes, the
> weapons, shields, what have you, are custom made works of art, and when we
> dismiss the price on something as "too high" and "not worth that" we
> diminish the effort of the artist.
>
> I don't know who made that shield.? I know that someone probably put a lot
> of energy, money, and effort into it, and might be a bit offended at some
> of
> the comments made.
>
> I know of many generous artisans in our kingdom and our game, who donate
> work and craft and art so selflessly that is astounds me.? Let us make sure
> that we keep in mind both the spiritual and the monetary value of their
> work, and thank them accordingly.
>
> My apologies for rambling, but this issue always bothers me a bit.
>
> JP
>
> Qui mieux fait, mieux vault.
> _______________________________________________
> Ansteorra mailing list
> Ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
> http://lists.ansteorra.org/listinfo.cgi/ansteorra-ansteorra.org
>
_______________________________________________
Ansteorra mailing list
Ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
http://lists.ansteorra.org/listinfo.cgi/ansteorra-ansteorra.org
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 14:15:59 -0700 (PDT)
From: julie mcknight <glasjulz55 at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] The Cost of Time
To: " Inc.Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA" <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID: <344106.52470.qm at web37505.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Waving to all my friends back home.......
?
Mistress Mara MacNaughton here,
So some?remember me some don't, but I felt I just had to respond.? This is not a problem that is limited to the SCA.? As the owner of my own studio I hear comments regularly like "oh I could do that" or "how much would you really charge for that piece".? I have found that when someone actually comes to my studio and takes a class do I hear "oh, its harder than it looks".? Rarely do we look at art or a helm or a shield that someone has made and think that every piece was touched by thier hand, that thier time is part of the art.? So thank you for posting as an artist I so appreciated it......
?
Mara
"Leap and the net will appear"
--- On Thu, 7/23/09, Jean Paul de Sens <jeanpauldesens at gmail.com> wrote:
From: Jean Paul de Sens <jeanpauldesens at gmail.com>
Subject: [Ansteorra] The Cost of Time
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Date: Thursday, July 23, 2009, 4:44 PM
The recent shield discussion, and the responses to the costs, has just
reinforced my belief that we (the SCA) and society in general have forgot
how much it costs to do *one* of an object.
Case in point, that shield probably has around $40-$50 of materials (glue,
wood, hose, maybe hidden u-channel, rope, bolts, nuts,primer, paint, finish
coat).
It also has (if I had to bet) around 20 hours of labor (cut shield,
laminate, sand, prime, outline pattern, paint, clear coat).
So if I were to pay some guy $10 per hour to do this, it would cost me
around $250 to do this shield.
If I had to run a business doing this, where I had to pay for construction
space, taxes, perhaps even health, insurance, etc etc, well, that $10 per
hour worker will cost around $25/hour.
Now the cost of that custom shield goes to $550.
Often, I feel that we in the SCA don't appreciate the monetary value of the
art works that people make.? The scrolls on our walls, the clothes, the
weapons, shields, what have you, are custom made works of art, and when we
dismiss the price on something as "too high" and "not worth that" we
diminish the effort of the artist.
I don't know who made that shield.? I know that someone probably put a lot
of energy, money, and effort into it, and might be a bit offended at some of
the comments made.
I know of many generous artisans in our kingdom and our game, who donate
work and craft and art so selflessly that is astounds me.? Let us make sure
that we keep in mind both the spiritual and the monetary value of their
work, and thank them accordingly.
My apologies for rambling, but this issue always bothers me a bit.
JP
Qui mieux fait, mieux vault.
_______________________________________________
Ansteorra mailing list
Ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
http://lists.ansteorra.org/listinfo.cgi/ansteorra-ansteorra.org
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 16:16:10 -0500
From: Charles ? Floinn <charles.ofloinn at gmail.com>
Subject: [Ansteorra] ISO H.L.Emma
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc."
<ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>, serveradmin at ansteorra.org
Message-ID:
<73d8ced60907231416l1dbbc0a3gee3ef1347328d3fd at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Grr.
Okay -- if it's still not working, let's try this.
Send a post to the list AND to serveradmin at ansteorra.org (both on the To:
line). That way I'll definitely get a copy of it, and I can then open a
trouble ticket with our hosting provider to look for the errant message that
didn't show up on the list.
-Emma
--
ld. Charles ? Floinn
Charles Flynn
charles.ofloinn at gmail.com
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 16:21:51 -0500
From: "Jennifer Smith" <jds at randomgang.com>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] ISO H.L.Emma
To: "'Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc.'"
<ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID: <559C2F2BEFC540FA8FA362DD271B5020 at bob>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Looks like it's working to me now. :)
-Emma
> -----Original Message-----
> From:
> ansteorra-bounces+jds=randomgang.com at lists.ansteorra.org
> [mailto:ansteorra-bounces+jds=randomgang.com at lists.ansteorra.o
> rg] On Behalf Of Charles ? Floinn
> Sent: Thursday, July 23, 2009 4:16 PM
> To: Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc.; serveradmin at ansteorra.org
> Subject: [Ansteorra] ISO H.L.Emma
>
> Grr.
>
> Okay -- if it's still not working, let's try this.
>
> Send a post to the list AND to serveradmin at ansteorra.org
> (both on the To:
> line). That way I'll definitely get a copy of it, and I can
> then open a
> trouble ticket with our hosting provider to look for the
> errant message that
> didn't show up on the list.
>
> -Emma
>
>
>
> --
> ld. Charles ? Floinn
> Charles Flynn
>
> charles.ofloinn at gmail.com
> _______________________________________________
> Ansteorra mailing list
> Ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
> http://lists.ansteorra.org/listinfo.cgi/ansteorra-ansteorra.org
>
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 16:38:47 -0500
From: Charles ? Floinn <charles.ofloinn at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] ISO H.L.Emma
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID:
<73d8ced60907231438o6d4a960x7cee00b09370d7ef at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
OK, I will try replying to an email again. thanks
On Thu, Jul 23, 2009 at 4:21 PM, Jennifer Smith <jds at randomgang.com> wrote:
> Looks like it's working to me now. :)
>
> -Emma
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From:
> > ansteorra-bounces+jds=randomgang.com at lists.ansteorra.org
> > [mailto:ansteorra-bounces+jds <ansteorra-bounces%2Bjds>=randomgang.com
> @lists.ansteorra.o
> > rg] On Behalf Of Charles ? Floinn
> > Sent: Thursday, July 23, 2009 4:16 PM
> > To: Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc.; serveradmin at ansteorra.org
> > Subject: [Ansteorra] ISO H.L.Emma
> >
> > Grr.
> >
> > Okay -- if it's still not working, let's try this.
> >
> > Send a post to the list AND to serveradmin at ansteorra.org
> > (both on the To:
> > line). That way I'll definitely get a copy of it, and I can
> > then open a
> > trouble ticket with our hosting provider to look for the
> > errant message that
> > didn't show up on the list.
> >
> > -Emma
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > ld. Charles ? Floinn
> > Charles Flynn
> >
> > charles.ofloinn at gmail.com
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ansteorra mailing list
> > Ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
> > http://lists.ansteorra.org/listinfo.cgi/ansteorra-ansteorra.org
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ansteorra mailing list
> Ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
> http://lists.ansteorra.org/listinfo.cgi/ansteorra-ansteorra.org
>
--
ld. Charles ? Floinn
Charles Flynn
charles.ofloinn at gmail.com
------------------------------
Message: 11
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 16:39:00 -0500
From: Lisa Sawyer <ysabeau.lists at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] The Cost of Time
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID:
<c09b4a160907231439i3cd05992n20ee5dd7280cc5f7 at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
A couple of years ago I was returning from Pennsic and the airlines lost my
luggage. I had almost every piece of SCA clothing I own in those suitcases,
not to mention jewlery and other accessories. Around week two of them still
not able to tell me where my stuff was or when I might get it back, I
started making a list of the items. When I started putting monetary value on
the clothing alone (cost of fabric + trim + time to make + cost of
maintenance for sewing machine), I was easily over the allowance the
airlines give you if they lose your luggage.
At one point, I got a customer service agent who "got it". After I
explained, once again, that the bags were full of custom made renaissance
costumes that could not be replaced at Target, she paused and said "You were
coming back from Pennsic, weren't you?". She made me feel better because
she told me that my bags would be found and they were probably still sitting
in Pittsburgh. Apparently, SCAdians tend to pack heavy for Pennsic. For
safety reasons they airlines can't put everything on the planes and it takes
a while for the bags to catch up. Considering that I helped a woman who was
trying to put a big period pavilion on as excess baggage (poles and all), I
can believe it. They finally delivered my bags with nothng missing 3 weeks
after my flight, much to my relief.
So, long story short, I totally agree with JP. We tend to underestimate how
much the items we make are worth because we are making them. If you had to
be reimbursed for your materials and time spent, how much would you charge
for that dress or spear? Probably not $1250 on average, but more than you
think.
my thoughts,
Ysabeau
On Thu, Jul 23, 2009 at 3:44 PM, Jean Paul de Sens <jeanpauldesens at gmail.com
> wrote:
> The recent shield discussion, and the responses to the costs, has just
> reinforced my belief that we (the SCA) and society in general have forgot
> how much it costs to do *one* of an object.
> Case in point, that shield probably has around $40-$50 of materials (glue,
> wood, hose, maybe hidden u-channel, rope, bolts, nuts,primer, paint, finish
> coat).
> It also has (if I had to bet) around 20 hours of labor (cut shield,
> laminate, sand, prime, outline pattern, paint, clear coat).
>
> So if I were to pay some guy $10 per hour to do this, it would cost me
> around $250 to do this shield.
>
> If I had to run a business doing this, where I had to pay for construction
> space, taxes, perhaps even health, insurance, etc etc, well, that $10 per
> hour worker will cost around $25/hour.
>
> Now the cost of that custom shield goes to $550.
>
> Often, I feel that we in the SCA don't appreciate the monetary value of the
> art works that people make. The scrolls on our walls, the clothes, the
> weapons, shields, what have you, are custom made works of art, and when we
> dismiss the price on something as "too high" and "not worth that" we
> diminish the effort of the artist.
>
> I don't know who made that shield. I know that someone probably put a lot
> of energy, money, and effort into it, and might be a bit offended at some
> of
> the comments made.
>
> I know of many generous artisans in our kingdom and our game, who donate
> work and craft and art so selflessly that is astounds me. Let us make sure
> that we keep in mind both the spiritual and the monetary value of their
> work, and thank them accordingly.
>
> My apologies for rambling, but this issue always bothers me a bit.
>
> JP
>
> Qui mieux fait, mieux vault.
> _______________________________________________
> Ansteorra mailing list
> Ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
> http://lists.ansteorra.org/listinfo.cgi/ansteorra-ansteorra.org
>
------------------------------
Message: 12
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 16:39:57 -0500
From: Charles ? Floinn <charles.ofloinn at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] Agincourt war records
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID:
<73d8ced60907231439m447f48d2w1a1130a852f94c4c at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
WHAT???? They went to war without a Foinn in their ranks? How did they
win???
On Tue, Jul 21, 2009 at 2:48 PM, Hillary Greenslade <hillaryrg at yahoo.com>wrote:
>
>
>
> Date: Tue, 21 Jul 2009 10:12:32 -0500
> From: Peter Holland <pholland64 at gmail.com>
> Subject: [Ansteorra] check this out
> To: Baorny of Bjornsborg <Bjornsborg at yahoogroups.com>, "Kingdom of
> Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
>
> found this on the BBC web site
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/8160081.stm
> ------------------------------------
>
> Thought it was interesting that the reason we have these records is because
> of the exchequer:
> Dr Bell said: "The service records survive because the English exchequer
> had a very modern obsession with wanting to be sure that the government's
> money was being spent as intended.
> "Therefore we have the remarkable survival of indentures for service
> detailing the forces to be raised, muster rolls showing this service and
> naming every soldier from duke to archer."
> He said accounts from captains showing how funds were spent and entries
> detailing when the exchequer requested the payments can be found.
>
> Cheers, Hillary
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ansteorra mailing list
> Ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
> http://lists.ansteorra.org/listinfo.cgi/ansteorra-ansteorra.org
>
--
ld. Charles ? Floinn
Charles Flynn
charles.ofloinn at gmail.com
------------------------------
Message: 13
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 15:10:02 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kaitlan Roisendubh <kaitlan_kiera at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] The Cost of Time
To: " Inc.Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA" <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID: <377891.34119.qm at web111503.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
I know that as a seamstress for both everyday clothing and SCA clothing people really don't have a clue as to what it takes.? I know that when I make an SCA Gown or outfit and the client gets me all the cloth and bits that it takes, (which as we all know can be a ton) I usually charge between $50 to $60 for labor, that is just labor.? For a complete gown or outfit it is much more.? People just don't seem to understand the cost or the time it takes to make something.? Some of the outfits take upwards of 20 hours to make and that is by machine not by hand.?
Lady Kaitlan Roisendubh
------------------------------
Message: 14
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 22:19:59 +0000
From: love at roseandchad.net
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] The Cost of Time
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID:
<346720750-1248387688-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-958121811- at bxe1265.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
My favorite seamstress only charges ten dollars per hour for labor and I am always amazed at the quality of work and what goes into it. She doesn't just sew a dress, she makes a dress that FITS! Any woman who is not shaped like a Barbie probably knows exactly what I am talking about.
Also, managing a jewelry store, I see a lot of people look at a piece and assume it is the same as something else they've seen. The differences are huge and apparent to me!
So I always hide a smile with the 'I can, too.' crowd, because the likelihood is they can't (or won't), and they are not who I work for, anyway. :)
Rose the Obnoxious
Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile
-----Original Message-----
From: Kaitlan Roisendubh <kaitlan_kiera at yahoo.com>
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 15:10:02
To: Inc.Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA<ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] The Cost of Time
I know that as a seamstress for both everyday clothing and SCA clothing people really don't have a clue as to what it takes.? I know that when I make an SCA Gown or outfit and the client gets me all the cloth and bits that it takes, (which as we all know can be a ton) I usually charge between $50 to $60 for labor, that is just labor.? For a complete gown or outfit it is much more.? People just don't seem to understand the cost or the time it takes to make something.? Some of the outfits take upwards of 20 hours to make and that is by machine not by hand.?
Lady Kaitlan Roisendubh
_______________________________________________
Ansteorra mailing list
Ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
http://lists.ansteorra.org/listinfo.cgi/ansteorra-ansteorra.org
------------------------------
Message: 15
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 15:24:42 -0700 (PDT)
From: Leslie Snipes <lesdsnipes at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] Lost Pennsic Luggage, was The Cost of Time
To: " Inc.Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA" <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID: <783047.96826.qm at web35501.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
I've often wondered how much Pennsic luggage ends up at the Unclaimed Baggage Center and whether or not the local SCA group shops there.? I would have found it very painful to be reimbursed $100 knowing the airline would sell the bag to the UBC for $50 while it would have taken me untold hours and big bucks to have replaced a bag full of SCA gear.? I think I would have had to make a trip to Alabama and camp there until my bag showed up so I could at least attempt to buy my stuff back.? "unclaimed baggage" what a lovely misnomer for legalized theft.
?
http://www.unclaimedbaggage.com/tourthestore.html
http://www.theemptycarousel.com/page2/index.html
Leslie S. 713-795-0811
------------------------------
Message: 16
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 17:44:37 -0500
From: John Atkinson <johnmatkinson at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] Agincourt war records
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID:
<aa9f2ea80907231544y2afc17c2je467a6e84bbc263f at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
On Thu, Jul 23, 2009 at 4:39 PM, Charles ?
Floinn<charles.ofloinn at gmail.com> wrote:
> WHAT???? ?They went to war without a Foinn in their ranks? ?How did they
> win???
As a point of fact, while the English army had occasional tactical
successes, they did actually lose the war. A point frequently
obscured by English writers of the previous century.
Ioannes
--
"Thousands of Sarmatians, Thousands of Franks, we've slain them again
and again. We're looking for thousands of Persians."
--Vita Aureliani
------------------------------
Message: 17
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 18:38:17 -0500
From: "Jennifer Jackson" <genevria at cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] The Cost of Time
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID: <EDEEFE7C173E465CB8868F1539BFDB13 at jackson6b762c4>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
Also the time spent to develop the skills to produce a piece of art and the
experience to do it just right.
Genevria
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lisa Sawyer" <ysabeau.lists at gmail.com>
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Sent: Thursday, July 23, 2009 4:39 PM
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] The Cost of Time
>A couple of years ago I was returning from Pennsic and the airlines lost my
> luggage. I had almost every piece of SCA clothing I own in those
> suitcases,
> not to mention jewlery and other accessories. Around week two of them
> still
> not able to tell me where my stuff was or when I might get it back, I
> started making a list of the items. When I started putting monetary value
> on
> the clothing alone (cost of fabric + trim + time to make + cost of
> maintenance for sewing machine), I was easily over the allowance the
> airlines give you if they lose your luggage.
>
> At one point, I got a customer service agent who "got it". After I
> explained, once again, that the bags were full of custom made renaissance
> costumes that could not be replaced at Target, she paused and said "You
> were
> coming back from Pennsic, weren't you?". She made me feel better because
> she told me that my bags would be found and they were probably still
> sitting
> in Pittsburgh. Apparently, SCAdians tend to pack heavy for Pennsic. For
> safety reasons they airlines can't put everything on the planes and it
> takes
> a while for the bags to catch up. Considering that I helped a woman who
> was
> trying to put a big period pavilion on as excess baggage (poles and all),
> I
> can believe it. They finally delivered my bags with nothng missing 3 weeks
> after my flight, much to my relief.
> So, long story short, I totally agree with JP. We tend to underestimate
> how
> much the items we make are worth because we are making them. If you had to
> be reimbursed for your materials and time spent, how much would you charge
> for that dress or spear? Probably not $1250 on average, but more than you
> think.
>
> my thoughts,
> Ysabeau
> On Thu, Jul 23, 2009 at 3:44 PM, Jean Paul de Sens
> <jeanpauldesens at gmail.com
>> wrote:
>
>> The recent shield discussion, and the responses to the costs, has just
>> reinforced my belief that we (the SCA) and society in general have forgot
>> how much it costs to do *one* of an object.
>> Case in point, that shield probably has around $40-$50 of materials
>> (glue,
>> wood, hose, maybe hidden u-channel, rope, bolts, nuts,primer, paint,
>> finish
>> coat).
>> It also has (if I had to bet) around 20 hours of labor (cut shield,
>> laminate, sand, prime, outline pattern, paint, clear coat).
>>
>> So if I were to pay some guy $10 per hour to do this, it would cost me
>> around $250 to do this shield.
>>
>> If I had to run a business doing this, where I had to pay for
>> construction
>> space, taxes, perhaps even health, insurance, etc etc, well, that $10 per
>> hour worker will cost around $25/hour.
>>
>> Now the cost of that custom shield goes to $550.
>>
>> Often, I feel that we in the SCA don't appreciate the monetary value of
>> the
>> art works that people make. The scrolls on our walls, the clothes, the
>> weapons, shields, what have you, are custom made works of art, and when
>> we
>> dismiss the price on something as "too high" and "not worth that" we
>> diminish the effort of the artist.
>>
>> I don't know who made that shield. I know that someone probably put a
>> lot
>> of energy, money, and effort into it, and might be a bit offended at some
>> of
>> the comments made.
>>
>> I know of many generous artisans in our kingdom and our game, who donate
>> work and craft and art so selflessly that is astounds me. Let us make
>> sure
>> that we keep in mind both the spiritual and the monetary value of their
>> work, and thank them accordingly.
>>
>> My apologies for rambling, but this issue always bothers me a bit.
>>
>> JP
>>
>> Qui mieux fait, mieux vault.
>> _______________________________________________
>> Ansteorra mailing list
>> Ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
>> http://lists.ansteorra.org/listinfo.cgi/ansteorra-ansteorra.org
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Ansteorra mailing list
> Ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
> http://lists.ansteorra.org/listinfo.cgi/ansteorra-ansteorra.org
>
------------------------------
Message: 18
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 19:43:50 -0500
From: Betsy Marshall <betsy at softwareinnovation.com>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] slightly OT: big artist competition
To: "'Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc.'"
<ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID: <001f01ca0bf7$d0140100$703c0300$@com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
I think Sarah Penrose and Deanna della Penna could sweep the mixed media
category...
-----Original Message-----
From: ansteorra-bounces+betsy=softwareinnovation.com at lists.ansteorra.org
[mailto:ansteorra-bounces+betsy=softwareinnovation.com at lists.ansteorra.org]
On Behalf Of Stephanie Smith
Sent: Thursday, July 23, 2009 8:54 AM
To: Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc.;
SCA_Scribes_and_Illumination at yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Ansteorra] slightly OT: big artist competition
This competition has some huge prizes. It is a modern competition, but
thought it might be of interest to our artisans. See link below.
*Utrecht Art Supplies* is proud to announce our 60th Anniversary Art
Competition, in appreciation for the patronage of Artists over the past six
decades. All Artists are invited to submit works created in Oil,
Acrylic,Watercolor or Mixed Media***.Winning entries will be judged on
quality, creativity and originality. Editors of American Artist, Utrecht
Resident Artist and Artists from the Ridgewood Art Institute will serve as
jurors.
***The mixed media category is open to two-dimensional, unique, original
works of art created with more than one drawing or painting materials.
Sorry, we are not able to accept works of art that include
three-dimensional, computer-generated, or photographic images. Click Here
<http://contests.interweave.com/utrecht/rules.aspx>For Full Contest Rules.
<http://contests.interweave.com/utrecht/rules.aspx>
_______________________________________________
Ansteorra mailing list
Ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
http://lists.ansteorra.org/listinfo.cgi/ansteorra-ansteorra.org
------------------------------
Message: 19
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 20:11:45 -0500
From: Rebecca Bevel <rebevel at hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ansteorra] ISO Sir Rhodri & Sir William of Weir
To: <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID: <BAY130-W1105276E1966120691F928A0190 at phx.gbl>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
Would you gentlemen be so kind as to contact me off-list?
I need the expertise of, apparently, some "cloddish stick-jockeys" =o)
Thank you,
Rebekah
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Store, access, and share your photos. See how.
http://windowslive.com/Online/SkyDrive?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_CS_SD_photos_072009
------------------------------
Message: 20
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 20:15:21 -0500
From: Paul Foster <sir.rhodri at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] ISO Sir Rhodri & Sir William of Weir
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID:
<b6a28c450907231815s26328fa3rb348ab71f4c4ab5a at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
hmm...
On Thu, Jul 23, 2009 at 8:11 PM, Rebecca Bevel <rebevel at hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Would you gentlemen be so kind as to contact me off-list?
> I need the expertise of, apparently, some "cloddish stick-jockeys" =o)
> Thank you,
> Rebekah
>
>
------------------------------
Message: 21
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 21:13:43 -0500
From: "HE Chiang" <chiang at clearwire.net>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] The Cost of Time
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID: <1ED36EA650BC4316B2C9D796FC795A37 at ChiangPC>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
I could make you a really nice spear, for a whole lot less than that,
depending on the metal you want for the blade.
HE Chiang
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lisa Sawyer" <ysabeau.lists at gmail.com>
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Sent: Thursday, July 23, 2009 4:39 PM
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] The Cost of Time
> So, long story short, I totally agree with JP. We tend to underestimate
> how
> much the items we make are worth because we are making them. If you had to
> be reimbursed for your materials and time spent, how much would you charge
> for that dress or spear? Probably not $1250 on average, but more than you
> think.
>
> my thoughts,
> Ysabeau
> On Thu, Jul 23, 2009 at 3:44 PM, Jean Paul de Sens
> <jeanpauldesens at gmail.com
>> wrote:
------------------------------
Message: 22
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 21:40:24 -0500
From: "William Meriic" <wmeriic at tx.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] The Cost of Time
To: "'Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc.'"
<ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID: <003701ca0c08$18f1c550$4ad54ff0$@rr.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> So, long story short, I totally agree with JP. We tend to underestimate
> how
> much the items we make are worth because we are making them.
Hmmm... a group of people who tend to put a low value on labour and a high
value on commodities. It is almost like we are recreating
pre-industrial-revolution times! :-)
Will Meriic
------------------------------
Message: 23
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 22:48:30 -0500
From: Bree Flowers <evethejust at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] The Cost of Time
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID:
<8e18eb3a0907232048p523e194fo69e20be6b573e84c at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
> Remember that next time you dismiss the work of an artisan in a
> merchan'ts booth as "something I could do." ?Particularly within their
> hearing.
And then there are the rare ones among us that when we see something
in a booth and say "I could do that" actually mean "holy crap, that's
awesome, I wonder if I can make one like that?" and run home and try
it. And we know full well that ours might not be as nice as the one in
the booth, but making it sure was fun. Or, conversely we see something
in a skill we already possess but in a pattern or style we hadn't
tried and get inspired to attempt something new, and we can in fact do
it just as well and in the exact color, style and size we want. When I
peruse lampworkers' and weavers' booths that is exactly my intent. I'm
not there to buy (sorry) I'm there to get inspired and break out of
doing the same old things. That said, even I will break out my wallet
for something really neat.
Long and short of it is that it might be admiration and the desire to
go home and imitate, not an insult.
I'm also guilty of totally undervaluing my worth when I do artistic
things, but in my case it's somewhat intentional. If I try to do art
"professionally" I know it will suck all the joy out of it. I have
done it once or twice and I always end up hating the product and the
process and regretting accepting the commission by the end of it. I
create because I feel compelled to and I gift my creations to people I
think will appreciate them. I won't accept payment (except in trade)
for any of my work because that way I don't have deadlines I have to
meet, or lose creative control. If I want to make money I'll go out
and get a job doing one of the soul-sucking, unsatisfying skills I
possess, and it will pay me a lot more than anyone would be willing to
pay for anything artistic.
~Eve
------------------------------
Message: 24
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 23:00:11 -0500
From: Kory-Kajira Lewis <torinsmail at hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ansteorra] Last fighter cards until after Pennsic--
To: "ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org" <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID: <BAY112-W144BB61BBDD51F31BAEE23DB190 at phx.gbl>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
Here are the latest batch of fighter authorization cards that will be mailed out tomorrow. Will not do another batch until the week of Aug 17th or the 24th (depending on Pennsic recovery time needs :) )
So, if you are going to fight before that time, make sure and do a temporary card so you can fight (or marshal, or waterbear, or shoot, or...)
1. Avallone, E
2. Burns, M
3. Cagle, B
4. Calhoun, K
5. Cavazos, J
6. Cockerham, L
7. Crane, J
8. Crouchet, J (youth and adult cards)
9. Crumrine, M
10. Drake, R
11. Dudley, J
12. Finell, G
13. French, P
14. Hammons, K
15. Herndon, D
16. Hertzberg, S
17. Holtgrefe, E
18. Kubasta, C
19. Lichorad, A
20. Lucas, J
21. McRae, j
22. Moore, M
23. Myers, A
24. Parrish, R
25. Pendleton, l
26. Pham, B
27. Polk, P
28. Powell, A
29. Powell, J
30. Rudin, J
31. Smith, Jessica
32. Smith, Jonathan
33. White, J
Have fun!
Kajira Camber
(Khayra bint Tahir ibn Rashid)
m.k.a. Kory Lewis
a.k.a. Rabbit's Wife
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live? Hotmail?: Celebrate the moment with your favorite sports pics. Check it out.
http://www.windowslive.com/Online/Hotmail/Campaign/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_QA_HM_sports_photos_072009&cat=sports
------------------------------
Message: 25
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 23:43:40 -0500
From: Alice Morrow Harris <AliceMorrowHarris at austin.rr.com>
Subject: [Ansteorra] HERALDIC HELP NEEDED
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <Ansteorra at ansteorra.org>,
Barony of Bryn Gwlad <bryn-gwlad at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID: <ED3EA194-0C80-46A7-A69D-8E5DA35F9B43 at austin.rr.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes
Greetings From Alina Unto All:
Can anyone send me a link to the outline of the Ansteorra star and a
Halberd? I'm trying to make something but I need a pattern of each of
them.
Thanks In Advance,
Alina
------------------------------
Message: 26
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 00:06:07 -0500
From: Stefan li Rous <StefanliRous at austin.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] The Cost of Time
To: "Inc. Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA" <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID: <BEEF63A4-9CD6-4C17-8A8D-8948ECF617CC at austin.rr.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes
Eve commented:
<<< I'm also guilty of totally undervaluing my worth when I do artistic
things, but in my case it's somewhat intentional. If I try to do art
"professionally" I know it will suck all the joy out of it. I have
done it once or twice and I always end up hating the product and the
process and regretting accepting the commission by the end of it. >>>
This is not an uncommon feeling among SCA craftsman/merchants. I think
it is well illustrated by this story which can be found in the
merchanting-msg file in the COMMERCE section of the Florilegium.
==================================
Date: Mon, 22 Feb 1999 00:37:04 -0600
From: Roberta R Comstock <froggestow at juno.com>
To: sca-arts at raven.cc.ukans.edu
Subject: Re: Arts/Crafts/Money
A while back there was a pricing discussion on another list (Weavers
Words - basketry list)
in which one of the well-known published instructors was asked about how
she prices a basket.
She gave a price for a specific basket of, say $25. When the potential
buyer asked her how much it would cost for a dozen of them, all alike,
the weaver said the cost would be $45 each, and probably higher yet for
larger quantities. The shopper was aghast, having hoped for a bulk rate
deal. But the weaver said the cost increase was based on how boring it
is to do the same thing over and over and how much she would hate to
spend the time doing so.
It seemed perfectly reasonable to me! Another reason I'm not a
merchant.
Hertha
=================================
Stefan
Hmmm. I wonder if there's any money in collecting obscure, odd info
and editing... :-)
--------
THLord Stefan li Rous Barony of Bryn Gwlad Kingdom of Ansteorra
Mark S. Harris Austin, Texas StefanliRous at austin.rr.com
**** See Stefan's Florilegium files at: http://www.florilegium.org ****
------------------------------
Message: 27
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 00:07:02 -0500
From: Elec inghean She?in <elecmaire at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] HERALDIC HELP NEEDED
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID:
<aff180140907232207q4137c81i88a3be4903aed160 at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Lady Elec sent via phone
On Jul 23, 2009 11:43 PM, "Alice Morrow Harris" <
AliceMorrowHarris at austin.rr.com> wrote:
Greetings From Alina Unto All:
Can anyone send me a link to the outline of the Ansteorra star and a
Halberd? I'm trying to make something but I need a pattern of each of them.
Thanks In Advance,
Alina
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------------------------------
Message: 28
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 23:49:34 -0700 (PDT)
From: Sca Godmother <scagodmother at yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ansteorra] Blowing Bubbles at Pennsic
To: ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
Message-ID: <809463.33520.qm at web111920.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Greetings!
I am hoping to see many of my friends from Ansteorra at Pennsic!
Peer, and Pauper, Squire, and Queen,
Come and blow bubbles with me on the Green.
Pirate, rogue, and Knight so bold
Remember what it was like before you got so old!
Duchess, Dancer, and Lady Fair
Come blow bubbles in the air.
Remember friends of days gone by,
Of friends no longer at our side,
Think of friends left at home,
I honor them with bubbles and a poem.
There are two magical times of day:
At the dawn and at the falling of the sun's ray's.
Join me blowing bubbles, in those beams,
Believe in magic and The Dream.
Battlefield, you, me, bubbles, friends at dusk, Priceless!
Your SCA Fairy Godmother
Look for me on Facebook as Sca Godmother
------------------------------
Message: 29
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 07:38:52 -0400
From: deboramarzec at aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] Blowing Bubbles at Pennsic (a period game
suggestion).
To: ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
Message-ID: <8CBDA6A73F0693A-110C-1BA5 at Webmail-mg09.sim.aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
A period bubble 'game' is for a pretty lady to stand on something so she is a little taller than everyone else. She then blows bubbles which must be caught on a small pillow. The first man to successfully catch a bubble and return it whole to the lady receives a kiss. He then blows bubbles for the ladies to catch and so on.
The period illustration has the lady blowing bubbles from a balcony. I use cheap felt squares to hand out instead of cushions as they are much easier to pack.
Have fun.
HL Debora of Durham.
-----Original Message-----
From: Sca Godmother <scagodmother at yahoo.com>
To: ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
Sent: Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:49 am
Subject: [Ansteorra] Blowing Bubbles at Pennsic
Greetings!
I am hoping to see many of my friends from Ansteorra at Pennsic!
Peer, and Pauper, Squire, and Queen,
Come and blow bubbles with me on the Green.
Pirate, rogue, and Knight so bold
Remember what it was like before you got so old!
Duchess, Dancer, and Lady Fair
Come blow bubbles in the air.
Remember friends of days gone by,
Of friends no longer at our side,
Think of friends left at home,
I honor them with bubbles and a poem.
There are two magical times of day:
At the dawn and at the falling of the sun's ray's.
Join me blowing bubbles, in those beams,
Believe in magic and The Dream.
Battlefield, you, me, bubbles, friends at dusk, Priceless!
Your SCA Fairy Godmother
Look for me on Facebook as Sca Godmother
_______________________________________________
Ansteorra mailing list
Ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
http://lists.ansteorra.org/listinfo.cgi/ansteorra-ansteorra.org
------------------------------
Message: 30
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 11:55:45 GMT
From: "willowdewisp at juno.com" <willowdewisp at juno.com>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] Fw: Anyone Missing a Shield?
To: ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
Message-ID: <20090724.065545.29791.2 at webmail23.vgs.untd.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
I think I saw a design like this for one the Larp kingdoms up North. Some of them use shields like ours.
willow
____________________________________________________________
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------------------------------
Message: 31
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2009 12:42:03 -0500
From: Tina Michael <tinabetta at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra] Blowing Bubbles at Pennsic (a period game
suggestion).
To: "Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org>
Message-ID:
<288803470907241042s38d9a4a3s2796c781344c51db at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
But wait! I'm not even going to Pennsic....
very Confused and a bit disappointed is
Bubbled Boudoir
On Fri, Jul 24, 2009 at 6:38 AM, <deboramarzec at aol.com> wrote:
> A period bubble 'game' is for a pretty lady to stand on something so she is
> a little taller than everyone else. She then blows bubbles which must be
> caught on a small pillow. The first man to successfully catch a bubble and
> return it whole to the lady receives a kiss. He then blows bubbles for the
> ladies to catch and so on.
> The period illustration has the lady blowing bubbles from a balcony. I use
> cheap felt squares to hand out instead of cushions as they are much easier
> to pack.
> Have fun.
>
> HL Debora of Durham.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Sca Godmother <scagodmother at yahoo.com>
> To: ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
> Sent: Fri, Jul 24, 2009 1:49 am
> Subject: [Ansteorra] Blowing Bubbles at Pennsic
>
>
>
> Greetings!
> I am hoping to see many of my friends from Ansteorra at Pennsic!
>
> Peer, and Pauper, Squire, and Queen,
>
> Come and blow bubbles with me on the Green.
>
> Pirate, rogue, and Knight so bold
>
> Remember what it was like before you got so old!
>
> Duchess, Dancer, and Lady Fair
>
> Come blow bubbles in the air.
>
>
>
> Remember friends of days gone by,
>
> Of friends no longer at our side,
>
> Think of friends left at home,
>
> I honor them with bubbles and a poem.
>
>
>
> There are two magical times of day:
>
> At the dawn and at the falling of the sun's ray's.
>
> Join me blowing bubbles, in those beams,
>
> Believe in magic and The Dream.
>
>
>
> Battlefield, you, me, bubbles, friends at dusk, Priceless!
> Your SCA Fairy Godmother
> Look for me on Facebook as Sca Godmother
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ansteorra mailing list
> Ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
> http://lists.ansteorra.org/listinfo.cgi/ansteorra-ansteorra.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ansteorra mailing list
> Ansteorra at lists.ansteorra.org
> http://lists.ansteorra.org/listinfo.cgi/ansteorra-ansteorra.org
>
--
Any day above ground is a good day!
------------------------------
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End of Ansteorra Digest, Vol 39, Issue 23
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