[Ansteorra-missile] Safety of Longbows - New Combat Archery Ruling

Mon Apr 21 09:30:25 PDT 2003

Greetings,

The text below is the portion that Jaques the Spink spoke about the 25%
misfire rate and the one line sentence stating the 2 reasons for
switching from a bow (either longbow or recurve) to crossbow.

Jaques' email dated, Sat, 19 Apr 2003:
"... As you point out- the accuracy of crossbows is greatly improved
although my own experience is that bows get about a 25% misfire rate.
This has prompted myself and a number of other archers to switch to
crossbow- simply for safety and accuracy of fire."

The last sentence above with the phrase: "...- simply for safety and
accuracy of fire."

What safety issue is he speaking about? Both Jaques and you offered up
no valid explanation that will stand up to the light of day here.
Jaques statements clearly imply that due to 25% misfire rate that he has
experienced, is prompting him and a number of other archers to switch to
crossbows. Which I believe is his and Ironwyrm's Household - Arkham.

(Not sure if you are member or not. It appears that the majority of the
archers here in Central Region are members. While I and a few others
remain in the minority.)

As it was clearly pointed out, at Gulf Wars XII - I shot arrows from
Arkham and had no misfires. The last battle was the 2nd Fort battle in
front of our kingdom and allies army. Once, again I will stated - NO
MISFIRES!

The issue that you, Wilim, raise about being Jaques being caught
defenseless if he can NOT get off a shot when he is in trouble and
"THAT"S UNSAFE". This is a load of "Bullsh*t!".

Just how is Jaques or anyone else "unsafe" if he can NOT get a shot off?
He is a non-contact archer the last I saw him on the field in armor. And
if he finally got authorized as a "Heavy Contact Archer", he and anyone
else still have the option to "Yield" before being hit. I am a heavy
contact archer, I have "Yield" to any fighter that crosses that boundary
of minimum range. Although there have been a few times in which I did
NOT see the fighter and I was hit. No big deal - and most of those times
the fighter demonstrated his/her respect and more importantly his/her
Honor and Courtesy by striking me in the helm or just tapping me. And
not "lighting" me up.

I do NOT shoot a crossbow, but even I know that the rate of fire from a
crossbow is far less than from a bow! By switching from a bow to a
crossbow, he and those he is representing here is trading speed for
accuracy (comparing a bow to a average crossbow) and not SAFETY.

So how is he or anyone else any better off by switching?

The answer he is NOT, nor is anyone else! You will still wound up being
defenseless and eventually "dead". A crossbow is "NOT A GET OUT FROM
BEING DEAD" card. And it has it own limitations on the battlefield.

If he is attempting to use the issue of the misfires as being a safety
hazard, then he does not know how to use his equipment. And following
that line of reason, there is potential for it will carry over to a
crossbow as well.

If Jaques or any other archer does not wish to be "defenseless", then he
and/or they should carry a secondary weapon. Be prepared to use it, but
more importantly KNOW how to use it. To know how to use a back-up weapon
as an archer, then you have to practice both one-on-one and small unit
tactics, plus actually practice in a war like setting.

Such as War practices in order to learn the best methods to drop both
bow or crossbow (although with a crossbow it has a higher profile on the
ground which could lend itself to tripping up some other fighter and if
already cocked a greater potential for causing harm if it is just laying
on the field), and your quiver. Then draw your back-up weapon!

Mistress Stella, of Elfsea, is one of the few combat archers who are
working the "kinks" out in order to do this. She is one of the few that
I have seen that actually knows what it takes to accomplish this, and I
applaud her for her efforts. Another archer is one with House Arkham -
Lothhair (sp?), he attempted to actually use his back-up weapon at
Border Wars III this year. Unfortunately, he did NOT quite get it right!
It takes practice and this practice MUST be in a war like setting of
some type to get "ALL KINKS" out before attempting to do the same thing
on a SCA battlefield!

Why am I suggesting a War practice instead of an actually war? Simply,
at a war practice, it is practice. Individuals are able to attempt
different methods to see just show something new would or would not
work. Ok, I have stated the obvious here, why? It is the feedback that
you would be able to get and the ability to try again. Which is NOT
something that you would ordinary get at a War event. This makes such
practices - "PRICELESS".

I agree, Fearghus is good with his bow. He and Mistress Stella took
advantage of the Central War Practices to come out to Carrollton to
practice as combat archers. I had the opportunity to face off with both
of them. It was indeed a fun war practice, because it kept me on my
toes. It also allowed me the opportunity to attempt some new attics as
well.

Wilim, I know that you were in armor and shooting your bow at Gulf Wars.
Although, I did not have the opportunity to witness your shooting and I
am sure that you did "kill" our opponents.

I must ask this question though - "Exactly when was the last time you
were in armor and shooting your bow, that is prior to this year's Gulf
Wars?"

Reason why I asked, every Central War practice that was held at Mary
Heads Carter park in Carrollton, when you did appeared but did not used
your bow. You did get into armor, but I believe that you Marshaled
rather than fought at the last practice that you attended. War practices
had been held in that park since June of 2002 right through March 2nd
2003 (yes, the weekend prior to Gulf Wars). To be fair to all the
fighters from Elfsea, (whether heavy fighters or combat archers), they
were not official informed about these practices to my knowledge until
after Gothic War 2002, it was more word of mouth. I could be wrong here,
but I believe the issue was with the chain of command within Central
Region for the official word not getting out.

So, Wilim it has been some time since I had the pleasure to witness you
shooting as a combat archer. I would enjoy either shooting with you or
shooting at you.

After all, if you are facing the wrong direction - then you deserved to
be shot!

Michael Fray
Unit Combat Archer for the Condottieri
King's Archer

Wilim Penbras ap Gurgeneu wrote:
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <meggiddo at netzero.net>
> To: <ansteorra-missile at ansteorra.org>
> Sent: Sunday, April 20, 2003 10:38 PM
> Subject: [Ansteorra-missile] New Combat Archery Ruling
>
> Okay, I remember Jaques saying something about having a 25% misfire rate but
> I don't recall anyone saying that a longbow was unsafe or less safe.  I'd
> have to guess Jaques' talk of switching to crossbow for "safety and
> accuracy" isn't related to the weapon but being caught defenseless if he
> can't get off a good shot when he's in trouble.  That's "unsafe".  He's
> gonna get dead fast that way.  Not hurt, but dead.
>
> Crossbows are easier and more effective if you don't have the time to
> practice that you need to put in with a longbow.  I'd be willing to bet that
> You, Fearghus and I(not to Toot my own horn) are the exceptions and not the
> rule when it comes to shooting effectively with Longbows.
>
> YiS,
>     Wilim
> > I DO TAKE EXCEPTION to the comments that a long bow or a recurve bow IS
> > UNSAFE or that a CROSSBOW is safer. I use a recurve bow and I do NOT
> > have a 25% misfire from that bow whether I am in full armor or not and
> > it makes no difference whether I am in training mode or on the
> > battlefield.
>
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