[Ansteorra-rapier] Spears for heavy Rapier

[James Crouchet]

I was not suggesting the SCA would find the combination of C&T and
pike acceptable, I was saying it was a decent historical model -- and
I would add that it is only so for a very limited set of circumstances
in assuming no cavalry or shot were available. It could have happened
and probably did somewhere (a mountain pass in the rain maybe?). I
guess we could throw in bows since that could have been accurate in a
limited set of circumstances up until around 1540 since the Brits held
on to their archers long after everyone else had gone to shot.

No, I don't think the SCA would accept C&T melee, at least not in the
near future. However, I expect even that would come to pass before the
SCA would approve the use of a weapon that can only be used with a
particular technique. Mandating technique is just not the SCA way.

Christian Doré



On Mon, Apr 20, 2009 at 12:16 PM, Sean Hertzberg <colsith at gmail.com> wrote:
> As the current C&T Marshal for Ansteorra, I will agree with what Corvin has
> said below.  The idea of C&T melee is fun...but the facts are that the SCA
> tends to authorize to lowest common denominator.  We are the big tent and we
> try to let everyone play.  C&T is is VERY much not that idea.  We currently
> have about 240 authorized rapier fighters in Ansteorra.  We have a grand
> total of less than 20 authorized C&T fighters and the majority of those are
> also marshals.  As stated below, this is not just an advanced
> authorization.  And I will be very willing to say it will remain as such for
> the forseeable future.
>
> One thing to remember...C&T is still new...and still judged as very strange
> and dangerous to some.  All it takes in one screw up and it can easily be
> gone.  It has happened in other kingdoms in the past.
>
> Don Avery Shaw, Baron of Bryn Gwlad
> C&T Marshal, Ansteorra
>
> On Mon, Apr 20, 2009 at 11:56 AM, Kevin Wilson <kevwilson at swbell.net> wrote:
>>
>> I seriously doubt we'll ever see a C&T in melees, and I'm not sure I'd
>> want to unless under VERY special and controlled circumstances.  Since we
>> cannot have C&T fighting vs. rapier, everyone would have to be doing C&T,
>> and I know I wouldn't want an entire army of rapier fighters doing C&T.
>>
>> C&T isn't just 'grad school rapier', being done by more
>> advanced/experienced fighters.  It's the study of Historical Technique being
>> applied in a way that is still considered new to the SCA.  The Society tends
>> to allow anyone who didn't injure their opponent in an authorization fight
>> the OK to fight with rapier (both heavy and light).  That is not the case
>> for C&T, nor should it be.  Every authorized C&T fighter has trained and
>> shown that they can fight with technique and control under any circumstance
>> they are likely to face.  It is FAR too easy to escalate calibration in
>> melees.  Doing so with a rapier leads to hard shots and lack of control,
>> occasionally injuring someone.  Lack of control and hard hits in C&T will
>> OFTEN injure someone.
>>
>> As for the spear/pike idea, while I'd love for melees to become more
>> historically accurate, I think that the potential for injury and squabbling
>> is greater than what we'd gain from doing it.
>>
>> Corvin
>>
>>
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