[Bg-dance] [discussion] Lazy Robin tune question

Wed Aug 24 11:37:53 PDT 2011

It's one thing to create a new dance based on period-type steps and
period-sounding music, but another to bring in something purely or mostly
modern.  We can't really fix past mistakes (and I do love Korobushka) but we
can try not to add new ones.  It's like the difference between sewing a
period-looking dress and getting something at the thrift store that looks
sort of medievaloid if you are drunk and forgot your glassses.

Gwenneth

On Wed, Aug 24, 2011 at 1:31 PM, s1ren <s1renwoman at gmail.com> wrote:

> re: SCA Traditional
>
> Just playing devil's advocate here, but, wasn't Heralds In Love created
> entirely within the SCA, the dance steps and the music both?  I'm not 100%
> sure on the music, but that's not actually my point - what I'm getting at
> is, wasn't every tradition new at some point?  Why not create something of
> our own? It doesn't have to mean a change in the way we do things in
> general, or a new standard; just an individual project type of thing.  I
> think it might be fun.
>
> ~ Madylyne
>
>
>
>  On Wed, Aug 24, 2011 at 1:24 PM, <star7fisher at aol.com> wrote:
>
>>   Lazy Robin / Robin Ddiog
>>
>> FYI: below is an on-going discussion from music guild and some dance
>> members - I added the bg-dance list to ensure all interested parties are
>> able to add their own 2 cents if they feel it worth adding.
>>
>>
>> Although the dance looks fun to do, I'm thinking curmudgeonly too.  Now
>> most of the moves are easily in alignment with period dance steps (except,
>> possibly, backing through an arch).
>>
>> However, it is clear in what online information I could find that the
>> choreography was created in the 20th Century.
>>
>> Arguably, we do dance Korobushka, which we now have researched to be
>> created from Russian (some say Ukranian) immigrants after they settled in
>> America in 1900's.  However, we dance Korobuskka, despite knowing better,
>> because it is an SCA-Traditional dance.  This means that it was introduced
>> and proliferated in the SCA, before we got more diligent about dance
>> origins.
>>
>> To my knowledge, the Robin Ddiog, was not adapted into the SCA or
>> well-spread throughout it if it was.  So it does not meet my standards - yes
>> I do have some - of the types of dance I promote:
>>
>> 1) pre-1650 dances of European origin (really 1699 for me <grin>)
>> 2) SCA Traditional dances
>> 3) SCA-created dances (member choreography), preferably based on authentic
>> pre-1650 dance styles and music.
>> If you want to dance the dance, it might be best to pursue it with a group
>> focused on folk dances rather than our own specific period and location
>> preferences.  There are a number of folk dancing groups around town.
>>
>> @Cindy <evil grin> The Macarina does not qualify as a bransle, because it
>> does not actually use sideways steps as is required for bransles.
>>
>> Star
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Zach Most <clermont1348 at yahoo.com>
>> To: bryngwladearlymusicguild <bryngwladearlymusicguild at yahoogroups.com>
>> Sent: Wed, Aug 24, 2011 10:42 am
>> Subject: Re: [bryngwladearlymusicguild] Fwd: Lazy Robin tune question
>>
>>
>>   I'm always up for learning a new song.  I've honestly been thinking
>> that it would be fun to do Metallica covers with early instruments.
>>   But philosophically, we have some obligation to keep things pre-1600.
>> It gets hard for dance since that limits them to choreography from the 15th
>> and 16th centuries.  If there's anything earlier than that I'd LOVE to see
>> it.  But there's a ton of material from the era that we haven't explored.
>>   I wish I'd been able to find a diplomatic way to express this last night
>> when the song was requested.  I'm sure the song is lovely and fun to dance
>> to, but I think we can find something more inspirational pre-1600.
>>   Gaston (who apparently is being a bit of curmudgeon today)
>>
>>  ------------------------------
>> *From:* Cindy Schaufenbuel <harponyou at yahoo.com>
>> *To:* "bryngwladearlymusicguild at yahoogroups.com" <
>> bryngwladearlymusicguild at yahoogroups.com>
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 24, 2011 9:34 AM
>> *Subject:* Re: [bryngwladearlymusicguild] Fwd: Lazy Robin tune question
>>
>>
>> I'm not a dance expert, so I have no idea whether any steps in the dance
>> itself "could not" have been done pre-1600. The tune itself could easily
>> have been written in period, even though it wasn't. But that's true of a lot
>> of "folk music."
>>
>> For that matter, I'm sure we could adapt the Macarena to something
>> resembling period and do that, too. Call it a bransle! Gaston, I can hear it
>> as a hurdy-gurdy solo.
>>
>> I'm kidding about that, of course, but I found this about the origins of
>> the "Lazy Robin" dance:
>>
>> Lois Blake, a founding member of *Cymdeithas Ddawns Werin Cymru* (Welsh
>> Folk Dance Society), devised the non-partner version of this dance to an old
>> Welsh tune in the 1940s. Michael and Mary Ann Herman introduced Blake's
>> version around 1952.
>>
>> http://www.phantomranch.net/folkdanc/dances/robinddi.htm
>>
>> If we want to pass a mid-20th century dance off as pre-1600, we could do
>> anything, really.
>>
>> Cecilia
>>
>>  ------------------------------
>> *From:* s1ren <s1renwoman at gmail.com>
>> *To:* David Shankle <gatsbydave at yahoo.com>; Hugh Ryan <
>> saporling2 at yahoo.com>; Cindy Schaufenbuel <cindy.schaufenbuel at gmail.com>;
>> bryngwladearlymusicguild at yahoogroups.com
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 24, 2011 9:08 AM
>> *Subject:* [bryngwladearlymusicguild] Fwd: Lazy Robin tune question
>>
>>
>> Morning, everyone!  I'm forwarding this email from Ld. Daniel de Lincoln,
>> containing a couple of music files and a video for *Lazy Robin*, the
>> dance tune that he was asking us about last night at PiP.  (Cindy, you
>> weren't there, but I thought you might be interested).
>>
>> From what [little] I could find out on the web with a quick glance is that
>> it's a "traditional" Welsh dance tune, possibly from the 1700s.   Daniel's
>> wondering if the music could be adapted to a more SCA-period style and
>> instrumentation, and danced to by our dance guild.
>>
>> I like it, and I think it could definitely work (heck, if we do Darabuska,
>> we can do this one, tee-hee).  What do you guys think?
>>
>> ~ Madylyne
>>
>> P.S. - I also found dance instruction to go with that video, if anyone's
>> interested:
>> http://www.pluckandsqueeze.com/Robin%20D.htm
>>
>>
>>
>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 10:17 PM, <tmcd at panix.com> wrote:
>>
>> This is the tune I mentioned at PIP.  I am wondering whether it sounds
>> at all plausible for a pre-18th century dance tune.  (Yeah, SCA period
>> is pre-17th C, but we go long with English country ...)
>>
>> Easier to pass URLs around than files.
>>
>> http://www.panix.com/~tmcd/lazy_robin.ogg
>> http://www.panix.com/~tmcd/lazy_robin.mp3
>>
>> This is a dance being performed to this tune and others.  There are 6
>> parts to the medley, and 1, 3, and 5 are the tune in question
>> (actually, the one above is a variant of this).
>>
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HVUe01_psdY
>>
>> Denyel Lincoln
>> --
>> Tim McDaniel; Reply-To: tmcd at panix.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
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