ANSTHRLD - Excerpts of returns: December LoAR in Da'uded text

[Timothy A. McDaniel]

Some of these actions or precedents are not innovations (nothing new
about withdrawing, frex).  I just thought it might be educational for
some to see some things that can cause return at Laurel.  I'm going to
remove a lot of obvious conflict calls.

Later: OK, there weren't any really obvious conflict calls.  There's
quite a variety of reasons for returns, actually.  I'll add comments
in [square brackets] for what I think was illustritive.


    From: Elsbeth Laurel <herald at sca.org>
    Subject: December LoAR in Da'uded text
    Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2001 18:11:25 -0500


THE FOLLOWING HAVE BEEN RETURNED FOR FURTHER WORK

{AE}THELMEARC

Corvinus filius Nennii. Name.
     The documentation was not adequately summarized in the LoI. Since
     the College did not provide documentation either, this will have
     to be returned as per the May LoAR cover letter.  Even after
     seeing the documentation submitted instead of just the summary on
     the LoI, it is unclear whether Corvinus is in fact a given name.

     His device is registered under the holding name Daniel of the
     Debatable Lands.

    [Two reasons for return, each sufficient on their own.
    Insufficient documentation on the letter to the College of Arms,
        and the CoA didn't save it.
    Insufficient documentation period.
    His armory was registered anyway under an administrative holding name.]

Hroswith of Southwoods. Name.
     This submission was withdrawn.

    [There are various reasons why a kingdom submission herald might
    withdraw a submission.  The submitter's request is the most
    obvious.  They may have found an undebatable conflict, though it
    would be rare to withdraw it then: better to just let Laurel
    return it.  There might be an administrative problem involving the
    kingdom with this one.]

Meadhbh inghean Sh{e'}amuis. Device. Argent, a dragon passant within
  an orle purpure.
     Conflict with Alberad von Westerwanna, cited in the letter of
     intent, Argent, a dragon statant purpure breathing flames proper,
     in dexter chief a cauldron purpure. There is a CD for changing a
     cauldron to an orle, but the orle's position on the field is
     forced, so there is not a second CD for changing the position of
     the secondary charge.

    [The RfS says that there's no CD for a forced change of position.
    Interestingly, it doesn't say about other forced changes.  For
    example, if it had been three cauldrons, then there's be a CD for
    type and number, even though a device can only have one orle.]

Sara of Cambridge. Device. Sable, a compass star and on a chief
  rayonny Or three roses gules.
     Conflict with ...  While the LoI stated that she
     has permission to conflict, documentation of this permission was
     not sent to Laurel.

    ["Non scriptum, non est", 'if it's not in writing, it doesn't
    exist', is one motto of the College of Arms.  The other is "Semper
    litteris mandate", 'Always get it in writing'.]

AN TIR

Beatrice Domenici della Campana. Badge. Vert, a mazer and in chief
  three lemons two and one fracted to base distilling gouttes Or.
     Conflict with Graffico de Drell, Vert, entwined about a chalice
     Or, a serpent head to sinister sable.  The serpent is not
     significant, therefore there is only one CD for the addition of
     the secondary charges. We would also like to see evidence of
     lemons or other fruit depicted this way in period heraldry.

    [It's not completely clear to me whether the non-standard fracting
    of the lemons is a second cause for return: "We would also like to
    see" is weaker than "We need to see".  It *probably* is a second
    cause for return.]

Darbie of Ironmaid. Reblazon of device. Per pale sable and argent, two
  dragons statant erect respectant counterchanged breathing flames
  proper, a chief per pale ermine and counter-ermine.
     We do not blazon tails in this position (curled loosely
     underneath).  If she redraws the device so that the tails are
     coward, then we can include the tail position in the blazon.

    [Didn't we have something like this not so long ago?]

Robert of Hawthorne. Device. Gules, a cubit arm sustaining a bow
  fesswise argent.
     By Laurel precedent (see the November 1994 LoAR, Cyril Bowman,
     pg. 12), the cubit arm/bow combination is disallowed by rule RfS
     VII.7.a "Identification Requirement" as it not sufficiently
     distinguishable from a cross bow.  It is thus also in conflict
     with Triaria de la Rivi{'e}re, Gules, a crossbow between four
     thistles in cross argent, with only a CD for the addition of
     secondary charges.

Terra Pomaria, Barony of. Order name Apple Blossom Award.
     No documentation was submitted for the order name, and the College
     did not provide any documentation either.
Terra Pomaria, Barony of. Order name Order of the Azure Iris.
    [ditto]
Terra Pomaria, Barony of. Order name Silver Apple Award.
    [ditto]
Terra Pomaria, Barony of. Order name Silver Otter Award.
    [ditto]
Terra Pomaria, Barony of. Order name Order of the White Scroll.
    [ditto]

    [Groups get no special slack, and Laurel is quite willing to
    cut-and-paste return texts.]

ANSTEORRA

Gwenlliana de Verdun. Name.
     No forms were sent to Laurel.

    [Non scriptum, non est.]

Muriel FitzLloyd. Device. Ermine, a talbot rampant contourny pean.
     No forms were sent to Laurel.  In addition, according to the
     Letter of Intent, this was submitted as a device for the alternate
     name Martin Fitzhug.  Please inform the submitter that she may
     only have one device; if she wishes to submit arms for her
     alternate person it must be submitted as a badge and on a badge
     form.

    ["Fitzhug"?  It is true that all the records for a person are
    filed under that person's registered primary SCA name, and that
    person may have at most one device.]

Thomas atte Woode. Name.
     This conflicts with Thomas Attwood (1783-1856), an English
     economist and leader in the electoral reform movement. Since he
     has his own entry in the on-line Encyclopaedia Britannica he is
     important enough to protect.

    [Inclusion in the EB is sufficient to get a name ruled
    sufficiently famous to protect under Admin Handbook III.A.3]

ARTEMISIA

Celestine of Arn Hold. Device. Per saltire purpure and vert, a swan
  rousant contourny argent.
     Conflict with Margarete Rau, registered November 2000, Per saltire
     purpure and vert, a swan rousant contourny wings displayed
     argent. There is only a single CD for the position of the wings
     (displayed vs. addorsed).

    [Wing position alone can be a CD.  Wing tincture too, and presence
    / absence of wings on something for which wings are optional (to
    wit: dragons were sometimes winged, sometimes not).]

Dragonmarch, Shire of. Device. Quarterly sable and argent, a dragon
  passant Or impaled on a sword inverted bendwise proper all within a
  laurel wreath Or.
     The petition did not include a description or picture of the
     proposed arms.  In addition, we are concerned about the
     identifiability of the sword, as it is almost completely covered
     by the dragon.

    [Non scriptum, non est again.  Bruce Draconarius had a precedent
    where he gave some slack to a group -- to the effect of "For all I
    know, it was a petition to serve ice cream at fighter practice.
    I'll give them the benefit of the doubt".  The benefit has run
    out.]

Madoc Kynith. Device. Argent, a goutte de sang within a vol throughout
 sable.
     While technically clear, this is in visual conflict with Hrolfr
     Lombungr, Argent, a pair of batwings conjoined sable, in chief a
     goutte de sang.  While the goutte is a primary charge in the
     current device and a secondary charge in the conflict, the visual
     similarity is overwhelming.

    [RfS X.5 visual conflict calls, like this one, are rare.]

Marcus Caecilius Existimator. Device. Gules, a pale wreathed argent
  and azure winged Or.
     No evidence has been presented, nor was any found, that ordinaries
     can be winged.  We could not reblazon this as a vol with a pale
     overall, as the wings clearly originate at the edge of the pale.

Tanglwyst de Holloway. Badge for Catriona Moriarty. Sable, a mullet of
  six points and a bordure argent.
     There are several conflicts, including Anna Tuomaantyt{a:}r von
     Urwald, Sable, a mullet and a base wavy argent, and the badge for
     Jayme O'Darcy of Glen Laurie, Sable, on a mullet throughout argent
     a cat's paw print sable, within a bordure argent. Against Anna,
     there is a CD for changing the base to a bordure, but nothing for
     the difference between a mullet of six points and a mullet of five
     points. Against Jayme, there is a CD for removing the tertiary
     charge, but again no difference between a mullet of five points to
     a mullet of six points nor between a mullet and a mullet
     throughout.

    [It's not exceptional: mullet conflicts come up frequently.  I
    eventually got tired of asking "do these two conflict?" and drew
    up a table of known conflicts and CDs for mullet-like things.]

Wolfram von N{u:}rnberg. Device. Or semy of wolf's paw prints, a wolf
  rampant azure sustaining a staff topped with a cross formy sable.
     The wolf's paw prints are so small as to be unrecognizable.
     Therefore, we are returning this for a redraw.

   [Unrecognizability is sometimes cause for return.]

ATENVELDT

Lachlan McBean of Kinchyle. Name.
     Kinchyle appears to be the clan seat of the MacBean, so the two
     names cannot be combined in this manner. As he does not allow us
     to drop elements of the name we have to return it. Also, the
     documentation for the name was not adequately summarised on the
     LoI, and we would have returned it for that reason as well.

     His badge has been registered under the holding name Lachlan
     McBean.

    [You can't be "<clan surname> of <seat of that clan>".  It's a
    long-standing precedent.  You CAN be "<clan surname>" of a place
    that was associated with that clan but which wasn't a seat --
    Alexander Mackintosh of Islay, frex.]

Sebastiana Gerynot Fanelli. Device. Per pale gules and purpure, on a
  pale Or between two rapiers inverted proper, a jester 's bauble
  proper, staffed bendy sinister argent and alternately gules and
  purpure, and hooded alternately purpure and gules.
     While the reasons for the previous return have been dealt with,
     this submission creates a new one.  No evidence has been presented
     for the coloration of the staff.  Treatments of the field were not
     necessarily used as treatments for charges, and therefore are not
     sufficient documentation to register this treatment of the staff.

    [Necessity may be the mother of invention, but invention is often
    the father of return.]

ATLANTIA

Andela Romier. Badge. (Fieldless) A mouse sejant ululant to sinister
  argent.
     While we allow wolves and foxes to be ululant, the head posture is
     an SCA invention. It is possible that had the head posture been
     introduced today we would not allow it.  Allowing ululant wolves
     is a step beyond period practice; allowing anything but canines to
     use the position is two steps beyond period practice and therefore
     grounds for return.

Cormac an Faoldubh. Device. Quarterly Or and azure, a cross
  counterchanged between in bend a wolf's head erased and a fret sable.
     By RfS XI.3, Marshalling, fields divided quarterly can only be
     displayed in a limited number of forms without creating the
     appearance of marshalling.  This does not qualify, because there
     is more than one type of charge on the field in addition to the
     cross.  As crosses were used in period as overall charges on
     marshalled coats of arms, adding it does not remove the appearance
     of marshalling.

    [A precedent that's moderately old.]

Derdriu ingen Muiredaig. Name.
     This is in aural conflict with Derdriu ingen Mhurchadha,
     registered in May 2000.

    [Name conflict calls are quite rare.]

Juliana la Caminante de Navarra. Badge. Sable, a Lacy knot Or
  conjoined at the tips to eight lily flowers argent.
     The lily flowers are unidentifiable when used at the ends of the
     knots; they could be easily misidentified as tassels which were
     used at the ends of knots. Therefore the badge is in conflict with
     Lacy (important real-world badge), A Lacy knot, with only a single
     CD for fieldlessness.

    [Invention strikes again.]

Kisaiya Zingara. Badge. (Fieldless) A sword inverted argent, entwined
  overall by a rose purpure, slipped and leaved vert.
     As drawn, the rose is barely overall.  This kind of overall charge
     has been disallowed for some time.  If drawn with a standard
     entwined rose, it is in conflict with Barbara Fitzhugh de
     Brandhard, Azure, a sword inverted proper entwined widdershins of
     a poppy proper. Traditionally, entwined charges are treated like
     maintained charges unless both charges have equal visual
     weight. Therefore there is not a CD for the change to the flower.

    [I wasn't sure about the treatment of entwined charges.
    This *is* consistent with other maintained/sustained charges.
    Invention again.]

Leonidas Mantineios. Device. Checky azure and argent, on a plate a
  dolphin naiant embowed sable.
     The large emblazon had colored the dolphin so that one of the fins
     and most of the face were argent.  As a result the dolphin has
     insufficient contrast with the argent roundel.  In addition,
     please instruct the submitter to draw the head of the dolphin in a
     more heraldic manner.

Muirgheal inghean u{i'} {O'}ga{i'}n. Device. Sable, a seadragon and in
  chief three annulets Or.
     Conflict with the badge for Ulric Grimmheld, reblazoned elsewhere
     in this letter, Sable, a dragon segreant guardant maintaining a
     sledge-hammer Or. Because a seadragon is almost identical in shape
     to a wyvern, which is an artistic variant of a dragon, there is
     not a CD between a dragon and a seadragon, and an examination of
     Ulric's device showed that the hammer was maintained. Thus there
     is only a single CD for adding the annulets.

...

Oriana of Xylina. Badge. Or, a lizard rampant sable, collared and
  chained argent, a bordure sable.
     The primary charge was not identifiable as a lizard.  The neck of
     the creature was too long, and the hind legs of the creature are
     significantly larger than the forelegs.  Both of these details
     were enough to question if the charge was actually a dinosaur, a
     creature unknown to period Europeans.

Timothy de Tindall. Device. Or, a bend sinister azure, overall a
  griffin sejant guardant maintaining in its dexter forepaw an eye
  sable irised Or.
     As drawn the overall charge is unidentifiable.  This combination
     of the guardant head and the badly drawn ears makes the type of
     head difficult to recognize, while placing the wings on the low
     contrast bend sinister further blurs the identifiability.

Ulric the Fox. Device. Per pale and chauss{e'} argent and sable, a
  fox's mask counterchanged.
     Conflict with the badge for Arinbjorn R{u'}n{o'}lfsson Rafnssonar,
     A wolf's head cabossed per pale sable and argent enflamed gules.
     An examination of the emblazon shows that the enflaming of
     Arinbjorn's head is not worth a CD.  Therefore, there is only one
     CD for adding the field.

Yevane Jameson. Device. Per pall inverted azure, vert and Or.
     Conflict with Rivika Vladimirovna Rivkina, Per pall sable, vert,
     and Or.There is a CD for changing the line of division from per
     pall to per pall inverted, but nothing for changing the tincture
     of one third of the field.

    [Field-primary armory conflict rules has some blank spots.  This
    fills one.]

DRACHENWALD

None!

LOCHAC

None!

MERIDIES

Pol MacNeill. Badge. Or, a gurges purpure within a belt sable.
     Armory using a charge within a belt strap is restricted as such
     motifs were used as a standard form of badge display in Scottish
     armory. "There is a precedent going back some eight years banning
     the use of the 'Badge within a strap' since this is a standard
     form of display for Scottish badges: the chief uses the plain
     badge and the clansmen use the badge within a strap. Therefore, we
     have on several occasions returned or pended submissions to allow
     them to be considered without the strap. In this case, dropping
     the strap would not be adequate to resolve this problem since
     conflicts then arise."  (January 1990 LoAR, p. 20)

MIDDLE

None!

NEBULY

Antwerp, City of. Device. Gules, a walled city and in chief a pair of
  hands in chevron inverted argent.
     This was ruled not important enough to protect in June, 1995 with
     the following comments: "Though the city itself is important in
     later period, and its arms relate to the legend of how the city
     received its name, the arms do not otherwise appear to be of
     sufficient importance for us to protect them."  No additional
     evidence was presented to lead us to change that decision.

Antwerp, Margraviate of. Device. Per fess Or and gules, in chief a
  double-headed eagle displayed sable and in base a walled city beneath
  a pair of hands in chevron inverted argent.
     No evidence was given that the Margraviate of Antwerp was an
     independent entity, nor that it is otherwise important enough or
     familiar enough to protect.  See the Cover Letter for more
     details.

[and lots more similar ones, some with more arguments]
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