[ANSTHRLD] Can someone conflict check this

Lisabetta mka Kimberly lisabetta_micola_damonte at yahoo.com
Tue Jun 4 11:18:30 PDT 2002


ok

--- Brent.Ryder at compucom.com wrote:
> > so would this pass?
>
> > > Borek writes...
> > > >> Purpure on a pile argent a rose purpure
> barbed & seeded Or
>
> >>Actually no; by X.4.j.ii(.a) you get one CD for
> changing the type of tertiary,
> >>since it's on an ordinary, so the proposed device
> is clear of Elewys Luscomb.
>
> Loads of fun. Strange this point hasn't come up
> before, makes conflict checking easier is some ways.
> According to the RfS found at
> http://www.sca.org/heraldry/laurel/rfs.html#10.4 :
>
> RfS X.4.j.ii.a states:
> ii. In simple cases substantially changing the type
> of all of a group of identical charges placed
> entirely on other charges is one clear difference.
> Only the new submission is required to be a simple
> case in order to benefit from the following clauses.
>
> Simple cases are defined by the following clauses.
> The word charge refers both to charged and to
> uncharged charges unless it is specifically
> qualified; a group of charges may contain one or
> more charges. A charge is suitable for the purposes
> of this rule if (a) it it simple enough in outline
> to be voided, and (b) it is correctly drawn with an
> interior substantial enough to display easily
> recognizable charges.
>
> (a) Armory that has a group of identical charges on
> an ordinary or other suitable charge alone on the
> field is a simple case.
>
> Sable, on a pale argent three lozenges sable has one
> clear difference from Sable, on a pale argent three
> ravens sable . Or, on a heart vert a pheon argent
> has one clear difference from Or, on a heart vert a
> cross moline argent . Argent, a lion rampant gules
> charged with a cross crosslet Or does not have a
> clear difference from Argent, a lion rampant gules
> charged with a heart Or because the lion is too
> complex in outline to be voided. Gules, on a mullet
> of six points Or a cross crosslet sable does not
> have a clear difference from Gules, on a mullet of
> six points Or a pellet because the interior of a
> correctly drawn mullet of six points is too small.
>
>
> So, since the device is considered 'simple' (as
> defined in the RfS) a CD can be obtained for
> changing only the type of teriaries which made your
> device clear of the conflict I called. But,
>
> > > There is a conflict, however, with Julian of the
> Purple Mist, 'Purpure, on a
> > > pile argent two sprigs of laurel proper'.  You
> only get a maximum of one CD
> > > for any changes made to a tertiary, per X.4.j.
>
> Which means you got a CD for the change in type due
> to X.4.j.ii.a, but not a second CD for changing the
> tincture of the tertiary since only one CD can be
> obtained by this rule for the change.
>
> This may make your suggestion of adding two roses as
> secondaries (Or or argent) more likely to not be in
> coflict. I'll have to check again to be sure.
>
> Borek
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>
>
>


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