[ANSTHRLD] Re: Stars

Tim McDaniel tmcd at jump.net
Sat Mar 9 18:40:22 PST 2002

On Sat, 9 Mar 2002, Bob Dewart <gilli at seacove.net> wrote:
> WOW!!  Thanks for all the up dating.

Darn.  Here I was working out ways to explain it further, with this
analogous period-style dialog on the subject of period archery
equipment between someone called Dan...er, Idiota, and the French
archer Galli.

> But it seems that the Order of the Golden Fleece would, at least
> somewhat, open the door to a wider area for research since it's a
> mythology thing.

Well, the Golden Fleece was a specific thing from mythology: the
fleece sought by Jason was loaded with gold, and famous and sought
because gold was valuable.  I would not use it to support Leaden
Fleece, for example.  Silver Fleece?  Hrm.

Also, Golden Fleece on its own does not support any other Golden --
Golden Hat, say.  However, there are enough other Goldens that Golden
<lots of things> would be justifiable.

Further, mythology is not metaphor.  I don't know of any metaphorical
order names (though I haven't looked closely), and I don't know of any
mythological story concerning a rising star in particular.  (If one
were found, the case would be strengthened.)  "Falling Star", for
example, *is* the basis for a large mythological story (Book of
Isaiah, perhaps?  Book of Daniel?).  Unfortunately, the basic
connotations for *that* aren't good, and while we have examples of
order names for saints, naming an order after Lucifer, Lord of Hell,
Father of Lies, seems, um, beyond the evidence.

(One thought just occurred to me: did they even say that stars "rose"
in period?  After all, they might have used some other word to
describe it.  For example, i believe that I've heard that "rolling"
applied to thunder appears to be a post-period usage.  Fortunately,
this *is* at least period.  The Oxford English Dictionary, the
definitive research dictionary, cites two uses from the 1300s:

    1340: Psalter xlix.2. Fra the risynge of the sune til the west, of
    syon the shape of his fairhede.

    1398: The furste ... haruese & gaderinge thereof is about the
    risinge of the sterre Canis.

Daniel, clerk
Tim McDaniel (home); Reply-To: tmcd at jump.net;
if that fail, my work address is tmcd at us.ibm.com.
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