[ANSTHRLD] Question on Name submission...

tmcd@panix.com tmcd at panix.com
Tue Nov 8 11:01:10 PST 2005

On Tue, 8 Nov 2005, Maria <scarlettmb at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> I am trying to find out if I can get the name Elizabetta Maria de
> Medici passed.  If the Maria part is a problem I can drop that but I
> really don't want to drop the de Medici part.

Do you have a time period and/or place in mind that you'd like it to
be authentic for?  To judge by the articles at the Academy of Saint
Gabriel site <http://www.s-gabriel.org/names/italian.shtml>, it looks
like we're getting enough data that we can actually suggest local
variations on occasion.

Having two given names is registerable in Italian without comment.

S. Gabriel report 3010, 26 Feb 2005,
<http://www.panix.com/~gabriel/public-bin/showfinal.cgi?3010+0> says

    You asked whether <Giacinta Maria Cocchetti> is an appropriate
    name for an Italian woman in the second half of the 15th
    century. ...

    The name <Maria> was moderately common in renaissance Italy [8].
    Double given names (or middle names) were used by at least some
    people in your period; we don't have a clear picture of how common
    they were, but we believe that only a relatively small number of
    people used them in the 15th century.  In the cases we've seen,
    the middle name is most often a saint's name, which makes <Maria>
    a good choice.  It was pronounced \mah-REE-ah\.

"a good choice" meaning "as long as you're going to have two given
names anyway, which was probably uncommon".

Elizabetta: Saint Gabriel doesn't have that exact spelling, but that
doesn't mean it didn't exist.  "Fourteenth Century Venetian Personal
Names" by Arval Benicoeur and Talan Gwynek
dates Elizabeta to 14th C Venice.  Do you care about the double T?

Maria: ibid. ["in the same place (used when citing a reference)"]

"de Medici" is slightly misspelled:

  Orlando dei Medici. Name and device. Or, a crequier vert.

      Listed on the LoI as Orlando de Medici, the submission form
      listed the name as Orlando de' Medici. The element de' is an
      abbreviation for dei. As we do not register scribal
      abbreviations, we have spelled it out.

      Nice device!

S. Gabriel report 1093
<http://www.panix.com/~gabriel/public-bin/showfinal.cgi?1093+0> says

    Both <Giovachino> and <de' Medici> are found in 15th century
    Florence [1], and the name <Giovachino de' Medici> is very
    authentic. ...

    Some of our members were uncomfortable recommending the surname
    <de' Medici>, since it will likely be associated in people's minds
    with the Florentine ducal family.  However, the ducal family did
    not exist as such in the 15th century, since the first duke of
    Florence was <Alessandro de' Medici>, who ruled from 1531-1537,
    later than your period.

    We also found examples of this name outside the immediate family
    and, given that the name is simply an occupational byname for a
    physician, it would be unsurprising to find other families sharing
    it.  In fact, the name <Medici> occurs sporadically throughout
    Italy [5], mostly in Liguria and Emilia-Romagna, and was one of
    the most common family names in early 15th century Florence
    [1]. You could therefore be <Giovachino Medici> as well.

Footnote 1 is the "On-line Catasto of 1427", q. v.  [5] is Emidio De
Felice, _Dizionario dei Cognomi Italiani_ (Arnoldo Mondadori Editori,
Milan, 1978).

"Names from Arezzo, Italy, 1386-1528" by Sara L. Friedemann (Aryanhwy
merch Catmael)
<http://www.s-gabriel.org/names/aryanhwy/names/arezzofull.html> notes
Francesco di Giuliano di Giovenco Medici, 1482.

"Family Names Appearing in the Catasto of 1427"
lists MEDICI with 31 instances: those names are normalized to
uppercase with particles dropped.

"de' Medici" and "dei Medici" have been registered 8 times in the last
11 years without comment.

Daniel Lincoln
"Me, I love the USA; I never miss an episode." -- Paul "Fruitbat" Sleigh
Tim McDaniel; Reply-To: tmcd at panix.com

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