[ANSTHRLD] Counting Tinctures/Complexity (WAS Conflict check please.)

[Bob Wade]

A note on why the complexity count is 8.  There are 3 charges.  Although the field and charges are composed of just black, green, purple and white, the tincture count is 5 rather than 4.  Why?  Furs (Such as vairy x and y) are counted as a single/separate tincture under SENA A.3.E.2 and ignores the tinctures of the component parts.  The result are tinctures of argent, purpure, sable, vairy and vert.

A reason Magnus and I have concerns about a charge/tincture complexity count of 8 goes back several versions of the Rules for Submission.  Raguly lines of division used to affect the complexity count towards armorial simplicity.

Tostig
--------------------------------------------
On Sun, 10/20/13, Doug Bell <magnus77840 at yahoo.com> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [ANSTHRLD] Conflict check please.
 To: "Heralds List, Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <heralds at lists.ansteorra.org>
 Date: Sunday, October 20, 2013, 3:56 PM
 
 I did check it and found no
 candidates for a conflict. No surprise. Purpure bend
 sinisters are quite rare in both SCA and period heraldry.
 No advice will be offered on period style either.
 The bend sinister purpure raguly edge is on the argent part
 of the field so it is identifiable. If it was raguly on both
 edges it would get vairy messy.
 
 There are two other issues that would be discussed at
 commentary:
 
 -Is the volant bendwise sable bird on a vairy argent and
 vert field identifiable?
 I don't believe that is the default posture for any bird in
 period. 
 
 It can be difficult to maintain the identity of an animate
 charge against a vairy field.
 
 
 -Will this get returned for excessive complexity?
 This armory pushes the complexity count to the legal limit
 and then adds the rare features of a vairy field, a charged
 vairy field, a bird in other than its default posture, and a
 bend sinister with two different types of edges.
 Taken all together this brings a risk of a return.
 
 
 It also must be checked for style issues under SENA. I
 haven't researched a device this complex under the new
 rules.
 
 Magnus
 
 
 
 ________________________________
  From: Bob Wade <logiosophia at yahoo.com>
 To: Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA Inc.Heralds List <heralds at lists.ansteorra.org>
 
 Sent: Sunday, October 20, 2013 8:21 AM
 Subject: Re: [ANSTHRLD] Conflict check please.
  
 
 To be honest, I don't _want_ to check something with a
 complexity count of 8 (5 tinctures and 3 charges), uses rare
 tinctures (vairy vert and argent), and has both a complex
 line of division and an orientation that have to be
 specified.  It's probably registerable, but would the
 submitter _please_ consider something closer to period
 style?
 
 Tostig
 --------------------------------------------
 On Sat, 10/19/13, Cisco Cividanes <engtrktwo at gmail.com>
 wrote:
 
 Subject: [ANSTHRLD] Conflict check please.
 To: "Heralds List, Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA, Inc." <heralds at lists.ansteorra.org>
 Date: Saturday, October 19, 2013, 11:13 PM
 
 "Per bend sinister vairy argent and
 vert, and argent, a bend sinister
 raguly on the lower edge purpure between a bird volant
 bendwise sable and a
 trefoil vert. "
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