NK - Re: NR - On Northkeep and Toy Tourney (LONG)

Marc Carlson marc-carlson at utulsa.edu
Mon Jul 5 13:21:26 PDT 1999

Sigen3 at aol.com wrote:

> Greetings to the lists, and apologies to those who receive this more than
> once.
> It has come to our attention that in the past, Northkeep may have caused some
> hard feelings over Toy Tourney.  We will try to address all of the points
> that were
> brought up.
> Northkeep wins because:
>         “we’re bigger than a lot of other places in the north, so we
>         have more money to toss into the pot”
> Truth to tell, the total number of populace members from the barony who
> donated
> toys last year was 24.  This is approximately 30% of our populace.  Some of
> the
> folks who donated toys actually had fund raisers to make money to buy the
> toys.
>         “we have some people who actually *have* the money to toss around
>           when -most- of the people in the SCA (at least in Oklahoma) are
> barely
>            making enough money to pay the rent)”
> It is true that some folks in Northkeep do have discretionary income available
> to buy toys for toy tourney.  That is their choice, and the children of
> Tulsa do
> benefit.  As pointed out above, some who did not have extra money actually
> held fund raisers, and had taverns to raise money to purchase toys.
>         “Then when we DO win, we aren’t terribly gracious about it, crowing
>          about it as though it really meant something”
> We are proud of our Barony.  We did not start the Toy Tourney.  When this
> group became a barony, we thought that as the “baby barony”, it would be
> fun to *try* to win a TOY TOURNEY.  Our group responded whole
> heartedly to our requests, and we did win.  If we did crow about it (we
> have tried to remember whether or not we made a big deal over winning)
> we can’t remember being obnoxious about it.  If we were, please accept
> our most humble apologies.
>         “from what I hear from elswhere, this is how it’s seen by many -
>          we push for competition that’s an easy win for us, and then rub
>         everyone else’s  nose in the fact that we (as a group) have more
>          money than they do”
> As noted above, we did not start the Toy Tourney, we only took up the
> challenge
> that was issued to us at the Crown Tourney that HE Mahdi won.  We have never
> pushed anything.  We have laid the challenge down at our populace meetings,
> and our populace has responded with their hearts to provide for children who
> would otherwise have nothing.  We do not recall ever rubbing anyone’s nose
> in the fact that our group collect lots of toys.  We have shared our knowledge
> with all who have asked “how do you guys get so many toys?”.  We simply
> do this for the children.  No other reason.  Yes we are proud of our members
> who try so hard to help out, but we would be equally proud of them if we had
> never won
> the tourney, simply because they did the best they could.
>         “The result of this is that some people in other groups -are-
> resentful
>          and pissed off, and the net result is that fewer people are willing
> to
>          participate and the kids wind up getting fewer toys.
> Again, we apologize if anything we have done has resulted in folks really
> feeling this way.  We are prepared to ask our barony to only compete
> amongst themselves if this would make other folks more willing to compete
> in the Toy Tourney.  The bottom line is that the more toys (and in Northkeep
> we also collect clothing, diapers, and toiletries)  we all collect, the
> more children will have something.  We were offered the challenge lo these
> three years past, and took it up with a good heart.  We will with the same
> good heart withdraw, should that be the desire of the region.  The children
> of Tulsa will still receive the toys from the folks here who wish to compete
> in-barony.
> It was never our intention to make anyone feel badly.  Our incredible populace
> has always taken up any challenge fully, and with much entheusiam.  We
> are grateful for that competitive spirit that has allowed us to make a
> difference
> in the lives of those less fortunate.  Again, we ask you to make known your
> thoughts on this.
> We remain in service to our Region, Kingdom, and the Children,
> Thorgrim and Sigen
> Northkeep
> ============================================================================
> Go to http://lists.ansteorra.org/lists.html to perform mailing list tasks.

  >It has come to our attention that in the past, Northkeep may have caused some
>hard feelings over Toy Tourney.  We will try to address all of the points
>that were brought up....

Just to be clear, your Excellencies, I was not making any accusations, I was
simply answering a question of why the rules might have been changed in this
fashion.  Now it is true that while I have heard these complaints, this is
my speculation based on things I have heard.  If I was unclear about that, I
apologize.  Also, if your Excellencies would be interested in discussing my
with me, I will be happy to do so, either here or privately.

It was never my intention that you should feel the need to defend yourself on this

issue.  Since I believe this to be a perceptual issue, there should be no real
ascribed.  Blame and Fault are concepts that are counter-productive to resolving
such differences of opinion.

Allow me to use an analogy.  Since Piotr referred to competition on the field, I
use one based on that.  let's assume you have two fighters, one wins, the other
It has happened in the past that the one who loses, and some of the spectators,
that the winner "Rhinohided".  Now we've all seen situations where this seemed to
the case, but may not have been (after all, we aren't out there on the field, and
we can't
always know what the person getting hit felt, right?).    So really what we have
is a situation
that *could* be one of three things:  1) the person really was playing unfairly,
2) the loser
is really just crying "sour grapes" (as has been suggested here), or 3) the people
have totally different, but equally valid, perceptions of the same event - neither
one really
right or wrong..

Personally, I believe that most situations fall into the last category, and in
this case, I am
fairly certain that this is what has happened in the past (I may be wrong, but
this is MY
opinion).  If that is the case, we can either develop into a "us"-"them" kind of
where everyone is resentful about something that's happened, or that they think
happened.  Or, we can understand that there IS another viewpoint that is just as
valid as
ours  (even though it's one that we don't happen to agree with).  From that we can
try to
work towards a better understanding and working together.  It was explaining this
viewpoint which was my reason for writing.


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