[Ravensfort] Fires&Defender

Cathal SilAlmhain silalmhain at yahoo.com
Tue Sep 6 11:18:42 PDT 2011


I concur with the analysis below.  But force can only be used if required to prevent immediate danger to life (property, too, yes, in Texas, but only under circumstances so complex that I can't summarize it here), and even then, must be limited to the force necessary to prevent the danger, and no more.  The whole force thing really is a non-starter, since it always opens up more problems than it solves, unless we are talking about life and death.

My suggestion is to have everyone who signs in also sign an additional "notice" which states what the burn rule is, states that they (the undersigned) understand, agree with, and will abide by the burn rule, and that violation of the burn rule will (not *may*--*will*) lead to immediate removal from the sight (it is much easier to megotatite down than negotiate up).  The notice should also state that special deputies will be patrolling to watch for problems, that everyone shall obey all directives given to them by the seneschal, autocrat, or any designated watch person regarding all fires, and that violation of the directives of any of these people will also lead to removal from the site.  I feel that making a legitimate plea to every participant's legitimate fealty to the dream and to the greater good of our common goal--sharing our game--will go a long way to making things go smoothly.

my 2p. 

Actually, at going rates, that advice is technically worth about $30.

Cathal



--- On Tue, 9/6/11, Joe McGrew <oscagne at gmail.com> wrote:

> From: Joe McGrew <oscagne at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Ravensfort] Fires&Defender
> To: "Lemoine Beers" <loco.cerveza at gmail.com>
> Cc: "Ravens Fort" <ravensfort at lists.ansteorra.org>
> Date: Tuesday, September 6, 2011, 7:48 AM
> The same as any security guard's
> powers...  they're based off the
> trespassing statute, which boils down to being a
> representative of the
> owner or tenant.  The barony would be considered a
> tenant of the
> property (just like anyone renting a party facility) and
> the barony's
> representative can ask to leave anyone who does not follow
> instructions.  If they refuse to leave then the
> representative can
> then say they no longer have permission to remain and must
> leave.  If
> they refuse to leave the law can be called.  Force,
> could be used in
> exigent circumstances when it is immediately necessary to
> prevent
> property damage, self defense, or defense of a third
> party.
> 
> The event steward is the legal representative of the barony
> during the
> event, and already has these powers.  He can also
> delegate that
> authority if they so choose.
> 
> Gregor
> 
> On Mon, Sep 5, 2011 at 10:59 PM, Lemoine Beers <loco.cerveza at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > Gregor
> >
> > That is a very good idea, the only problem is a legal
> problem. Where does a
> > said fire watch person rights to stop or prevent the
> actions of another
> > begin and end? Could force as defined by Texas law be
> used to stop lets say
> > a drunk person from doing something that would start a
> fire? Don't get me
> > wrong I support your idea, but at the same time you
> have to look at law
> > suits and a person trying to do the right thing going
> to jail for saving
> > every ones life.  This is something that would have
> to be bounced of of
> > Dominique before we did it.
> >
> > Later
> > Lemoine de Gascony MKA "L.D. Beers" loco.cerveza at gmail.com
> >
> **********************************************************************************************************
> > "for my purpose holds To sail beyond the sunset, and
> the baths Of all the
> > western stars, until I die."  --Tennyson
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Sep 5, 2011 at 10:46 PM, Joe McGrew <oscagne at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>
> >> Perhaps there could be someone appointed to the
> position of Watch, and
> >> be in charge of Fire Watch and stay on duty and
> sober throughout the
> >> event and enforce the fire regulations.
> >>
> >> Gregor
> >>
> >> On Mon, Sep 5, 2011 at 9:38 PM, Lemoine Beers
> <loco.cerveza at gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >> > As it stands right now I have to agree with
> with Dominique in this
> >> > matter. I
> >> > do not think we will receive enough rain
> between now and then to quiet
> >> > the
> >> > fears of a forest fire, but I am confident
> that the members of Raven's
> >> > Fort
> >> > as well as Ansteorra understand the danger
> and will adhere to any rules
> >> > put
> >> > into place by David Saint David for this
> event. I am also confident that
> >> > David Saint David will have more the acquit
> measures in place to keep a
> >> > forest fire from breaking out. The only
> reason that I would see for
> >> > canceling the event would be if there was an
> existing forest fire that
> >> > could
> >> > spread to our event, and or the smoke from
> said forest fire made it
> >> > unbearable to hold the event. As Dominique
> pointed out the final call is
> >> > up
> >> > to the land owners.
> >> >
> >> > Later
> >> > Lemoine de Gascony MKA "L.D. Beers" loco.cerveza at gmail.com
> >> >
> >> >
> **********************************************************************************************************
> >> > "for my purpose holds To sail beyond the
> sunset, and the baths Of all
> >> > the
> >> > western stars, until I die."  --Tennyson
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
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