SC - artificial

[Marian Deborah Rosenberg]

Lady,
I'm so sorry that you feel "slammed", etc.  I'm sure that few, if any, on this list
meant anything that way.  I think what I've seen on the list in the short time I've
participated, is a group of people whose views range from the super-recreationist
who wants to do everything as close to period as possible, to folks like you who
are just getting started.  To be honest, I fall somewhere in between, even though
I've been doing this for a number of years.

I can certainly sympathize with your frustration over a lack of books...and the
prohibitive cost of purchasing them.  It's only been in the last few years that
I've noticed that a lot of them have become available...and that I've been able to
afford them.  Up until that time, I've had to "make do" with reading everything I
could get my hands on (like "TI" and the Compleat Anachronist...not to mention cook
books published within the SCA...like In Service to Our Middles and How to Cook
Forsoothly..most of which would be "poo-pooed" by some of the super
recreationists), work as often as possible in the kitchens of those who seemed to
know how to do what they do so well and take any classes that might be available.
I also tried taking things that I knew to be period and coming up with dishes that
I thought might have existed in period...things that were somewhat ubiquitous, like
stews, etc. (Don't tell anyone--I still do that, if I need to!).  As time has gone
on, I've been fortunate to gradually increase the size and breadth of my library,
and have, through talking with people (like the ones on this list) improved my
knowledge.  One great example is how to get the flavor of the Seville Oranges that
existed in period...I didn't know how to do that when I started on this list, but
now I do!

I think what you have to do is what I quickly found out when I joined the SCA...you
have to learn that some of us don't quite know how to express ourselves and our
views in a diplomatic fashion...one designed not to hurt the feelings of those
around us.  You have to deal with this in one of 2 ways:  either challenge the
offending statements and let the person know that they have offended you or simply
consider the source!

I sincerely hope you won't cut yourself off from this method of learning because
you've been offended...you'll be removing yourself from a great source of knowledge
and information.  I also hope that nothing I have said along the way has offended
you...

Kiri

"B. M. Crumb" wrote:

> LrdRas at aol.com wrote:
>
> SNIP
> >
> > Personally, common sense regarding the recreation of period recipes is a
> > focused attempt to follow any given recipe as exactly as is possible whatever
> > measures are needed to accomplish that.
> >
> > Ras
>
> I'm giving up my attempts to do medieval cooking.  More and more
> I've gotten the sense from the posts on this list that if I'm not
> willing to bankrupt myself to buy ingredients that are not easily
> or affordably obtainable near me, and continue to follow my
> decision that I will not ingest wine or beer or ale as an
> ingredient in my food and will therefore leave that out or
> substitute for it, I cannot consider myself a medievalist cook.
>
> I don't have access to primary sources, and only have ready
> access to the Miscellany or the Florilegium to get recipes that I
> can use.  No one I know actually owns an Apicus or even a copy of
> Pleyn Delit, and my budget constraints mean that I can't order
> them from internet bookstores.
>
> I hear people say "don't substitute," "don't leave out
> ingredients," implying that if I don't do it perfectly EXACTLY
> according to the written original, that I'm a failure as a
> cooking re-enactor.
>
> Have any of you people who keep harping about "periodness" really
> looked at what you are saying to those of us with less
> experience?  To me, it sounds a whole lot like, "If you aren't
> going to do it right (IOW, exactly as the original source
> documentation--or as "I"--say), don't even bother to do it."
>
> In the months I've been on this list, I've seen new folks appear,
> and then rapidly disappear when we get a thread like the "period"
> ingredients one going.  I have enough problems with self esteem
> in my "Real Life (tm)" without having to feel slammed because I'm
> not in a position to do everything in an exact "period" manner.
>
> The whole response on the "Period Ingredient List" was a great
> example of what I'm talking about. Someone came up with an idea,
> meant to be truly helpful to beginning cooks, and then all the
> people who are adamant about only doing feasts set in one
> particular place and time period started going on and on and on
> about how it was a bad idea unless the author of the list was
> going to specify just when each type of food was used and so on.
> Good grief!  Not all of us are ready to cook an perfect
> Andalusian Muslim wedding feast circa 1239.... some of us just
> want to get started doing things that aren't too complicated.  We
> want to feed our patrons tasty foods that didn't break the bank
> nor our sanity in cooking them.  We need our confidence built up,
> not smashed down because we are doing a "generic" feast with
> ingredients and recipes from throughout the "official timeline."
>
> I'm sorry if I've offended anyone with this post, but I'm tired
> of feeling like I'm worthless as a cook because I can't come up
> to someone else's standards of what makes a successful SCA feast
> menu and presentation.  Not all of us have been active in the SCA
> for as many years as many on this list, and not all of us have
> had an opportunity to get to have hands on training from the
> "professional SCA cooks" who appear to be the ones we are
> measured against.  Many of us have to work alone with no input
> from experienced "kitchen stewards" or whatever the politically
> correct term is today.
>
> If you people who are ranting on about feasts that use a variety
> of recipes from a variety of eras in the SCA period aren't right
> would quit griping about how your perfection isn't being reached
> and insisting that we do it "your way," would instead do
> something like come up with a recipe and procedure primer for the
> beginners to feastocratting (yes, I used THAT word), with simple
> but effective recipes that individually would teach the basic
> methods of food preparation, and still make a tasty meal for the
> populace being served--that's the sort of support I was hoping
> for when I joined this list.  Instead, I've become less and less
> enthused about doing medieval cooking.  Why should I be excited
> about getting a frumenty made that my kids will eat, when I'm
> going to see a post on the list saying that I should have done it
> another way--implying that my accomplishment is worthless?
>
> Oh, I've been able to post a thing here or there about purchasing
> sources for odd things like the golden syrup, but just about
> anything else I've posted here about my experiences in the
> "medieval kitchen" has been ripped apart, ignored, or damned with
> faint praise.  I was going to simply unsubscribe quietly and
> forget about all this, but I decided that my feelings are valid
> and that I had a right to present them.
>
> Farewell. Maybe I'll come back someday... but if it's just more
> of the same, then I won't be sticking around then either.
>
> Bernadette
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