[Sca-cooks] chowder - OOP

[Philip & Susan Troy]

Also sprach Erika Thomenius:
>>See, that's exactly my point. Universal chowder orthodoxy does not
>>exist,
>
>It does too!  Heretic!  I will launch the jihad!  :)
>
></fanatic>
>
>[much good argument snipped]
>
>>But how can you argue with such a fine, old, established New England
>>tradition as putting tomatoes in chowder? ;-)
>>
>>Adamantius, who hates canned Manhattan Chowder, but likes home-made,
>>among several other kinds
>
>Well, GEEZ, if you're going to go be all REASONABLE about it... :)

They all hate it when I do that...

>Ok, then, I admit, the few times I have been persuaded to let the False
>Chowder through my lips, I have had no idea of its provenance.

I suspect provenance is an important issue, but far more broad an
issue than merely whether it is canned. Another sub-aspect of
canned-ness is the fact that some companies, for example Progresso,
seem to think if a product contains tomatoes, it should contain all
sorts of herbs and other ingredients traditionally associated with
Italian pasta sauces. I have seen "Manhattan" Chowder with pasta
shells in it, and garlic and oregano, for example.

>   For all I
>know, it may have come from a can.  And it was noxious.

Under/overcooked tomato-sour noxious, no?

>   So, good gentles
>all, I challenge thee.  Provide me with or point me to a good recipe for
>*coughsplutter* Manhattan clam chowder.  I will acquire the ingredients,
>make it up and serve it forth.

I would say that canonical Manhattan chowder is clam; its fish
equivalent, made with tautog/blackfish or striped bass, or more
rarely, cod, is a Montauk Point thang. Note that New Yorkers don't
get all huffy about tomato-less chowders; they're much to smart to
look a gift clam in the mouth.

I can do that, although a Montauk version with fish may be closer to hand.

A counterchallenge, though, since your confidence level is so high.
Find a modern chowder recipe, which produces the thick, smoothish
(excepting clams or taters, that is), white milk and/or cream stuff
that most people today associate with New England, that is older than
1900. Do we have a deal?

I'm asking because I can provide tomato recipes out the wazoo; I
can't guarantee how well they'll go with your personal tastes, and
then I did not raise the issue of preference, really. Just the issue
of orthodoxy, so what I'm really asking for is proof that the stuff
in cans of New England clam chowder, or even its higher-quality,
home-made counterpart, is in fact orthodox, or even a tradition older
than, say, 100 years.

And the honor and glory, of course, lie in the attempt, so never fear
on that score.

Adamantius

--
"No one who cannot rejoice in the discovery of his own mistakes
deserves to be called a scholar."
	-DONALD FOSTER