[Sca-cooks] OT & OOP: Greasecar?

[Terry Decker]

>Hm... looking at http://www.greasecar.com/

OK.

>Canola oil and soybean oil, which are already mass produced, are
>vegetable oils and are widely trumpeted by Magdalena vander Brugge's
>favorite sources as relatively energy efficient land uses. Soybean oil
>could be produced without using any petroleum products if the soybeans
>were grown by people not using minimally-mechanized growing methods.
>Pressing seeds for oil could be done with a minimally mechanized press
>run by waterpower or animal power. :)

In 1997, the US was consuming 848.6 metric tons of crude oil per year.  In
2003, the US produced 328.9 metric tons of oilseed.  I haven't determined
how much oil that amount of seed produces, but I'm certain it is less than
the gross weight.  Even at 1:1 we would need to obtain 2.5 times the amount
of oilseed we currently produce for fuel before we took into account how
much we need for other purposes.

I would say non-mechanical means of production are left at the door.

>
>> What are the costs of storage, transport, and dispensing?
>
>For fresh oil, the costs would be less than for petroleum as seed oils
>can be grown close to the consumers, and the safety requirements for
>transporting vegetable oils are less because they pose slightly lower
>safety hazards.
>
>At the moment, the cost of storage, transport and dispensing for used
>oil is pretty much a negative number as it results in lowering the costs
>of storage, transport and disposal of used oil.

The volumes of oilseed needed for widespread use negate the idea of them
being grown close to the consumer.

The costs of transportation and storage have less to do with safety
requirements and more to do with equipment and facility cost.  These should
be about the same.  However, you would still need diesel fuel available in
addition to the vegetable oil (for start-up and shut down).

At the moment vegetable oil vehicles are a toy, so the current costs are not
applicable to an evaluation of widespread use.  A competative use for used
oil would convert it from waste to salvage overnight.  Practical use on a
large scale seldom has negative or low cost.

>
>>What kind of
>> pumping equipment will be required?
>
>Apparently, pumping can be done with a siphon and a filter. The cost for
>this runs about $10 per filter, apparently

Yeah.  And I can fuel my car with an Oklahoma credit card, too.  What is
going to be needed to do this in large scale?  And I will point out none of
us have even touched on the governmental regulation for widespread use.

>
>> What are the emissions and by-products?  How will they affect air
quality,
>> particularly in less than optimal conditons (I suspect the smog might be
>> veddy nasty)?
>
>Again, burning vegetable oil is much more efficient than burning
>petroleum diesel fuel, so there is less soot. (Not difficult to
>imagine.) I remember this from something my Dad said back in the 70s.
>
>The Greasecar people have some techspecs up:
>http://www.greasecar.com/tech.cfm

Burning vegetable oil is cleaner than burning diesel, but diesels tend to
inefficient combustion leaving a lot of particulates in the exhaust.
Gasoline engines tend to burn cleaner than diesels and from the little I've
seen the Honda Z-LEV engine beats other gasoline engines in clean emissions.
But that doesn't get us away from fossil fuels.

As for the Greasecar specs, they are tests between fuels on a single
vehicle.  The tests need to be run on other Greasecars to get a statistical
comparison of Greasecar fuels.  Then you need a series comparing different
types of engines to the Greasecar diesels.

>
>Right now, as an alternative to a petroleum engine, seems like a
>vegetable oil/diesel combination running on used fryer oil would be a
>step up. Electric cars using electricity generated by Wind energy would
>be even better, obviously...
>
>--
>-- Jadwiga Zajaczkowa, Knowledge Pika jenne at fiedlerfamily.net

While it is a fun toy, I don't think vegetable oil diesels are going to
replace gasoline engines anytime soon.  Electric cars also have thier
drawbacks.  Hydrogen looks to be the most promising fuel source, but safety
requirements are a serious economic issue there and the best fuel cell
technology I've seen still uses fossil fuel.

Bear