[Sca-cooks] Re: Shepherd's Pie
tracey sawyer
tfsawyer at yahoo.com.au
Tue Jan 27 22:32:26 PST 2004
Amazing -- you use minced (ground) beef for shepherd's pie!?!!
In Australia it has always been minced mutton (or lamb) left over from roast lamb dinners.
In our (admittedly short) history, as shepherds herd sheep - not cows - and the mutton was available for them to cook and eat, presumably at the cost of raising them, where they would have had to pay cash money for beef, it has ALWAYS been sheep meat.
Diced beef is "goulash" and ground beef is Mince Meat (just to confuse the issue, mincemeat (one word) in minced up dried fruit.
-- Isn't it interesting the variations on a theme you get, when you cross national/international borders.
-- Lowry
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Shepherd's Pie (a5foil)
2. Re: Shepherd's Pie (Susan Fox-Davis)
3. Re: Shepherd's Pie (Marcus Antaya)
4. Re: Shepherd's Pie (ranvaig at columbus.rr.com)
5. Re: Shepherd's Pie (Barbara Benson)
6. Re: Shepherd's Pie (Phil Troy/ G. Tacitus Adamantius)
7. Re: Shepherd's Pie (Liz Courts)
8. Re: Shepherd's Pie (Jessica Tiffin)
9. Re: Shepherd's Pie (Phil Troy/ G. Tacitus Adamantius)
10. Re: Shepherd's Pie (M. Traber)
11. Re: Shepherd's Pie (Etain1263 at aol.com)
12. Re: Shepherd's Pie (Patrick Levesque)
13. Re: Shepherd's Pie (ekoogler1 at comcast.net)
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Message: 1
Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 22:51:13 -0500
From: "a5foil"
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Shepherd's Pie
To: "Cooks within the SCA"
Message-ID: <003201c3e488$cfe23720$0101a8c0 at pavilion>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Interesting, I just made a sort of mock shepherd's pie last night, after not
making anything of that ilk for years. For me it's always been ground beef,
onions, and gravy with mashed potatoes on top. (I've never heard of
tomatoes/tomato sauce in it before, or cheese either for that matter.) This
time (Tom now being allergic to all things bovine) I used ground turkey and
added mushrooms. Next time I am going to try the potato shortcrust thing,
thanks Adamantius!
Aelfwynn / Cynara
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 20:13:26 -0800
From: Susan Fox-Davis
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Shepherd's Pie
To: Cooks within the SCA
Message-ID: <2793B1E3-507F-11D8-A6DB-0050E4D01822 at earthlink.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
On Jan 26, 2004, at 7:28 PM, Phil Troy/ G. Tacitus Adamantius wrote:
> Also sprach Susan Fox-Davis:
>> On Jan 26, 2004, at 6:43 PM, ranvaig at columbus.rr.com wrote:
>>
>>>> How do you folks make Shepherd's Pie?
>>>>
>>
>> With real shepherds! [Wyde Evyle Grynne]
>
> I believe the line you're seeking is:
>
> "Shepherd's pie peppered
> With actual shepherd
> On top..."
>
> Qu'est-ce-que c'est cheese?
>
Probably a remnant of the way they made it in the school cafeteria. At
least they left out the ketchup, the other "universal condiment" of
school food aside from canned gravy.
Selene C.
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 23:55:15 -0500
From: "Marcus Antaya"
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Shepherd's Pie
To: "Cooks within the SCA"
Message-ID: <001b01c3e491$c1fbc780$684cfea9 at laptop>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Actually, my Mom used to make Pate Chinois, which is the french name (
although why Shepherd's pie got translated to Chinese pie is beyond me.)
Mine is just Ground beef, diced carrots, salt, pepper and worstershire sauce
with whatever spices you like.
Topped with mashed potatos and then (here's the kicker) a can of creamed
corn.
sprinkle with parmesan cheese, or just some bread crumbs...it makes a nice
crust on top and adds a delightful sweeteness to it. I do this sometimes
with noodle casseroles, but only when my wife's not here...she hates it and
gets very irate when I do....
Gyric
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 00:15:50 -0500
From: ranvaig at columbus.rr.com
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Shepherd's Pie
To: Cooks within the SCA
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"
>Actually, my Mom used to make Pate Chinois, which is the french name (
>although why Shepherd's pie got translated to Chinese pie is beyond me.)
Looking around on the net, I find this called a French-Canadian recipe, which
still doesn't explain why they think its Chinese.
Do you put the corn under the potatoes (like other versions of this recipe)
or over them, like your directions seem to call for?
Ranvaig
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 00:21:44 -0500
From: "Barbara Benson"
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Shepherd's Pie
To: "Cooks within the SCA"
Message-ID: <004d01c3e495$73faeb70$0a00a8c0 at hal9000>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> Adamantius> Crust can be mashed taters or shortcrust, or
> even a potato shortcrust (which is just like it sounds, cold mashed
> potatoes worked with flour as for gnocchi, but with fat worked in, as
> for shortcrust -- the result can be rolled out somewhat thickly,
> puffs up a bit, and browns well -- also makes great potato scones).
Greetings,
This sounds delicious, could you be more specific on how to prepare it.
Right now those instructions bear a strong resemblance to a period recipe.
Some proportions would be nice.
Glad Tidings,
Serena da Riva
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 01:00:38 -0500
From: "Phil Troy/ G. Tacitus Adamantius"
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Shepherd's Pie
To: Cooks within the SCA
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"
Also sprach Barbara Benson:
> > Adamantius> Crust can be mashed taters or shortcrust, or
>> even a potato shortcrust (which is just like it sounds, cold mashed
>> potatoes worked with flour as for gnocchi, but with fat worked in, as
>> for shortcrust -- the result can be rolled out somewhat thickly,
>> puffs up a bit, and browns well -- also makes great potato scones).
>
>Greetings,
>
>This sounds delicious, could you be more specific on how to prepare it.
>Right now those instructions bear a strong resemblance to a period recipe.
>Some proportions would be nice.
Hmmm. Let me think about this a bit...
Prolly...
1 1/2 cups cold, mashed potatoes (lumps are okay, this will be
pastry, not baby food)
3/4 cup flour
1/2 cup sweet butter (part of this as bacon fat is good, too)
appr. 1 tsp salt
Basically work it like a shortcrust pastry (chop or break, with your
fingers, the butter up into little crumby pieces), but note that no
additional liquid (or only very little, if you really need it) is
called for.
You should get something like a biscuit dough. Roll out about 1/4 to
1/2 an inch thick...
Adamantius
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 22:37:16 -0800
From: Liz Courts
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Shepherd's Pie
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
Message-ID: <4016071C.2000804 at bendcable.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
Meat of some sort - ground beef or venison :-)
Vegetable that's on hand - corn, peas, and onions go well together
Gravy
Smashed Tatoes - I like to season my smashed tatoes with dill, pepper,
and whatever else sounds good that evening.
I did make a pie with a maple sausage-apple-red onion & potato stuffing
- was really really good, especially with sour cream on top.
Ignia il Nomade
Suifu of the Oni-Ryu
Shire of Corvaria, Principality of the Summits, Kingdom of AnTir
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 11:11:25 +0200
From: Jessica Tiffin
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Shepherd's Pie
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.0.20040127110705.00a38060 at pop3.iafrica.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
At 09:31 PM 1/26/04 -0600, Adamantius wrote:
>Cottage pie is what I associate with ground beef, although all the
>Irish diners in my neighborhood (yes, we have Irish diners, where,
>instead of pastitsio and moussaka at 3AM, you can get black puds with
>fried tomatoes and curried chips...) refer to the ground-beef cottage
>pie under mashed potato crust as shepherd's pie...
Here in Cape Town, I make cottage pie with ostrich mince, which is leaner,
slightly darker and more flavourful than beef. I also tend to make it
rather like a bolognaise - onions, green pepper, grated carrot, chopped
tomato, tomato paste, red wine, garlic, mushrooms, fairly moist. It
wouldn't occur to me to put mixed veges into it :>.
And the secret of the topping is to add garlic, cream cheese and finely
diced rosemary and chives to the mashed potato. Which I make with the
skins on. Because I like the flavour, and it makes me feel slightly less
unhealthy ;>. My housemate, who is a heretical German, likes cheese on
top. Weird.
We have heatwaves in Cape Town. How's everyone's winter... ? :>
JdH
Jehanne de Huguenin (Jessica Tiffin) * Drachenwald Kingdom Chronicler
Shire of Adamastor, Cape Town, South Africa
melisant at iafrica.com *** http://users.iafrica.com/m/me/melisant
Sable, three owls rising argent, each maintaining a willow slip vert.
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 06:02:42 -0500
From: "Phil Troy/ G. Tacitus Adamantius"
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Shepherd's Pie
To: Cooks within the SCA
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"
Also sprach Jessica Tiffin:
>Here in Cape Town, I make cottage pie with ostrich mince, which is
>leaner, slightly darker and more flavourful than beef. I also tend
>to make it rather like a bolognaise - onions, green pepper, grated
>carrot, chopped tomato, tomato paste, red wine, garlic, mushrooms,
>fairly moist. It wouldn't occur to me to put mixed veges into it :>.
Clearly, though, this suggests that you don't see the dish as a
secondary by-product of something else. (This is a common, if
heretical, interpretation ;-) ) Perhaps, if you did, the vegetables
would make more sense. For some reason, though, the "mixed
vegetables" term may have some bad associations for some people..
there used to be, and may still be, a somewhat sinister canned
product called Veg-All. My choice of vegetables was more a dark
mirepoix (a pretty standard French formula of aromatics used for
stocks, sauces, and meat dishes) with optional added mushrooms, peas,
and, possibly, turnip. But "mixed vegetables"? Naaaah.
>And the secret of the topping is to add garlic, cream cheese and
>finely diced rosemary and chives to the mashed potato. Which I
>make with the skins on. Because I like the flavour, and it makes me
>feel slightly less unhealthy ;>. My housemate, who is a heretical
>German, likes cheese on top. Weird.
Yeah, weird. But ostrich is not... I calculate some two extra grams
of fiber per serving, plus the 870 extra grams of fat per serving
from the cream cheese; I'd say that evens out, no? ;-)
>We have heatwaves in Cape Town. How's everyone's winter... ? :>
We've been running just about fifteen degrees Fahrenheit below
average, pretty consistently, for the last several weeks. They say
global warming and other weather weirdness is caused by trees...
Adamantius
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 06:18:15 -0500
From: "M. Traber"
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Shepherd's Pie
To: Cooks within the SCA
Message-ID: <401648F7.3030706 at earthlink.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
lol, i had the craving for NY state public school 'gulash' which is
fried ground beast [i do remember on more than one occasion when it was
'monky meat'[horse] ] tomato or spaghetti sauce and elbow macaroni, and
occasionally if you were lucky melted mozarella on top. the NY public
school shepherds pie was ground beast, brown gravy, fried onions and a
crust of mashed potatoes.
just every now and then i get wierd food cravings, and oddly enough,
those 2 dishes were among the better ones on the menu...
that's what started it all=)
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Aruvqan, nicknamed Margali
http://www.geocities.com/aruvqann/index.html
No matter where you go, there you are.
------------------------------
Message: 11
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 06:56:54 EST
From: Etain1263 at aol.com
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Shepherd's Pie
To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
Message-ID: <1cb.188bef71.2d47ac06 at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
I always use "leftovers"...even the mashed potatoes! It's what you make for
Sunday supper when you've had the roast beast (beef, pork, etc) and mashed
potatoes for dinner. In reality, I don't really do the "Sunday dinner" thing
all that much..so I use whatever veggies are stashed in the frig from previous
meals. I always save the gravy, too. I have never even heard of tomato
sauce in this dish. I just started sprinkling cheese over the top when I saw a
friend do it.
Etain
------------------------------
Message: 12
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 08:51:31 -0500
From: Patrick Levesque
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Shepherd's Pie
To: "Cooks within the SCA "
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
On 27/01/04 00:15, "ranvaig at columbus.rr.com"
wrote:
>> Actually, my Mom used to make Pate Chinois, which is the french name (
>> although why Shepherd's pie got translated to Chinese pie is beyond me.)
>
> Looking around on the net, I find this called a French-Canadian recipe, which
> still doesn't explain why they think its Chinese.
>
> Do you put the corn under the potatoes (like other versions of this recipe)
> or over them, like your directions seem to call for?
>
Traditionally, French-Canadian pâté chinois is made with one layer of ground
beef, one layer of corn above, and topped with one layer of mashed potatoes.
Some people cover it with cheese as well.
Never developped much o liking for the meal, however :-)
Petru
------------------------------
Message: 13
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 13:58:14 +0000
From: ekoogler1 at comcast.net
Subject: Re: [Sca-cooks] Shepherd's Pie
To: Cooks within the SCA
Message-ID: <012720041358.12713.479 at comcast.net>
>
> I did make a pie with a maple sausage-apple-red onion & potato stuffing
> - was really really good, especially with sour cream on top.
>
Recipe? Directions? Something? This sounds like one of my favorite
combinations...often Phillip will do either sausage or scrapple and fried apples
for breakfast. And we are very fond of the maple sausage.
Kiri
------------------------------
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