[Sca-cooks] Fruit or vegetable?

[Terry Decker]

>I am looking for a working definition between a fruit and a vegetable.
>
> Does anyone have a good one? Or comments on the below?
>
> The many definitions I have found are at odds with each other or fog
> the issue with ambiguity!
>
> There is a broad definition of vegetable as the edible part of a
> plant. So a fruit could be considered a vegetable since one
> definition of a fruit is the mature ovary of a plant (an edible part
> of the plant).
>

So, the first differentiation is that anything that is not a mature ovary 
(tuber, rhizome, leaf, etc.) is a vegetable.  You should also consider that 
"fruit" is a common term that also has the strict botanical meaning you 
quote above.  "Vegetable" is a common term not used botanically.  A 
botanical synonym would be "plant."  Common usage tends to lack the 
precision of scientific usage and therefore may have broad, irregular or 
overlapping scope.

> Another definition is that a vegetable is the edible product of a
> herbaceous plant (soft stemmed) and a fruit is the edible product of
> woody stems such as shrubs and trees. So a melon would be a
> vegetable, but most people would consider it to be a fruit. Tomatoes
> would be a vegetable (soft stemmed) but it could be consider a fruit
> because 1) it is the mature ovary and 2) yet another definition of a
> fruit is that it "carries seeds" vegetable do not (Lettuce, carrots,
> etc.)
>
> A definition from the late 1400's (in Italy) would be ideal since the
> paper I am working on deals with vegetables from that time period and
> place. Platina has multiple definitions for fruits and vegetables,
> but doesn't have a hard and fast rule (that I can find yet!). Florio
> (later period Italian to English dictionary) is of no help from the
> fruit end of things and confusing on the vegetable side.
>
> Any help or ideas would be appreciated.
>
> Eduardo

Platina wrote in Latin.  Unless you are reading a Latin transcript, you are 
looking at a translation of the original text.  In translation, the 
translator tends to choose phrasing best understood by the target audience 
rather than the most precise wording.  You need to check the original to try 
to determine what Platina was actually saying.

I would point out that "vegetable" in its early sense means "having to do 
with life and growth."  Vegetable, as we use it, meaning "having to do with 
plants" is apparently an artifact of the late 16th Century.  A dip into the 
OED (which I don't have available right now) should provide more information 
about the shift in usage.

Bear