[Ansteorra-rapier] Advisory Role

Walter Robin wr at plumes.org
Mon Jul 16 14:11:48 PDT 2001

replies throughout...

----- Original Message -----
From: "Sean Hertzberg" <s_hertzberg at hotmail.com>
To: <ansteorra-rapier at ansteorra.org>
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2001 2:13 PM
Subject: Re: [Ansteorra-rapier] Advisory Roll

> >The caterpiller can not know what it is to be a butterfly.
> Sorry Walter, I VERY much disagree.
> The WS are not perfect, they are human.  And they are not Gods.  They are
> the representatives of the rest of the rapier community to the Queen.  I
> have had this talk with several WS who I respect and they pretty much
> that they view themselves sort of like elected officials with the rapier
> community as their constituancy.  It is their job to see that the views of
> the group as a whole are heard as well as their own.

In general, yes.  But in regard to candidates to join their order?  I have
seen WS's ask for opinions, but my perception was that they did so as
friends ( i.e. sounding out a non-WS friend ), rather than as a polling of
the community.

To experience is to know.  If someone is elevated or not elevated, and I
disagree, then who is wrong?  The reasons for that decision are probably
going to be beyond my purvue.

Two views, I guess:
pragmatic)  The circle is self-defining.  Only the circle knows what It is.
And it redefines itself with each addition.
idealistic) There exists an Ideal outside of the circle.  The circle is an
order to recognize those who embody that Ideal.  If the Ideal exists
regardless of our definition, then, yes, we all have a role in attempting to
describe it.

> >As far as marshallate, rules, and community issues, perhaps the
> >roundtable ( no more than 2 per year ) at a class-type event for an
> >agenda-d
> >discussion would be interesting.
> Don't forget, officially, the WS Circle has NOTHING to to do with the
> marshallate anymore.  There are WS in the Marshallate, but the Circle does

Agreed; My reply perhaps did not imply strongly enough that I was taking it
as a separate issue.

> Sorry, wrong, thank you for playing.  It has happened before and I am
> that someday it will happen again.  No matter what the Circle says, the
> decision to give someone a WS is in the hands of the crown.  Any Queen can
> give WS to anybody they want, be it the most deserving candidate, or her
> favorite cabana boy that she thinks will look cute as a Don.  We have been
> lucky, it has not happened in a while.  We have had a string of Queens
> have cared and not forced anyone in.  But Queens have walked into the
> in the past and announced "I am giving so-and-so a WS...and oh, what do
> vote?"  And this does a VERY great disservice to the candidate (who will
> always carry the stigma of "yeah, he has a Scarf, but...") and to the rest
> of the community.

Once a candidate is elevated, for whatever reason, are we not obliged to
treat them equally?
If we perpetuate that stigma, are we not merely pretending to let the queen

A symbol must represent something or it is meaningless.  And the fact of the
matter is, the WS garners a lot of respect.  The symbol means SOMETHING or
we wouldn't care about this topic.  A queen or wearer who uses a symbol
wrongly devalues the symbol.  But you can never be sure how someone is going
to turn out.  And the circle has survived.

However, I really do think that a wearer will be respected until they prove
themselves otherwise.  I have a responsibility, I think, to respect the
office (if not the person), because there may be those (young,
impressionable fighters) who are cueing their behavior from me.

Walter Robin

More information about the Ansteorra-rapier mailing list