ANSTHRLD - Associated checks for device: Sable, a sextant Or.

[tmcd at jump.net]

On Mon, 13 Sep 1999, Teceangl <tierna at agora.rdrop.com> wrote:
> Kathri wrote:
> > I have a potential submitter who believes that 'Sable, a sextant
> > Or" is clear of conflict
>
> Is it?  What entry?  I find the quadrant, but there are no sextants
> in SCA armory that I can find, and the date of invention according
> to encyclopedia.com is 1731, while the quadrant is said to have been
> "used to find latitude in medieval times".

Ooo, good point!  Yes, you're right.  The sextant has been returned
in-kingdom in the past.  Wait, I have Collated Commentary on-line -- I
can search.  I remember it being spelled "sextent", and various jokes
being made.  (flip flip flip)

Christoforo Antonio Passavanti (Twr Cath), New Name, New Device, item
2 on the 1/96 ILoI.  Son of a gun, it's "Sable a sextent Or".  Same
guy, Kathri?

This is the collated commentary from the time.  Da'ud:

    [Device] According to the OED, the first reference to a sextant
    (with an "a".  A "sex-tent" would have other, non-navigational,
    uses entirely. :-) ) is in a book published in 1603 in which the
    author claims to have invented it.  This makes it a post-period
    artifact and thus inappropriate for use in SCA armory.  Would the
    client consider the more widely used and period navigational
    instrument, the astrolabe?

Talan wrote:

    [Device] 'sextent' is presumably a temporary brothel; the
    submitter appears to want a sextant.  We've never registered the
    charge before, though Trimaris registered the title Sextant Herald
    12/85, so I expect that Laurel will require evidence that the
    device is period.  According to the OED, Tycho Brahe wrote in 1602
    that he gave the name to the instrument.  (The name was already in
    use with another meaning.)  From this I infer that the device was
    probably period, though very late; it may have changed form
    somewhat in the last 400 years, however so, some documentation to
    show that this is a period design is probably needed.

Bryn Gwlad:

    [Device] We could not find any examples of a sextant in the
    Ordinary.  Is this the defining instance of the charge, and if so,
    do we need to see documentation of this drawing as a period
    representation?  No conflicts found.

Stargate:

    [Device]  We would need evidence that a sextant is a period charge.

Twr Cath:

    [Device] (Clear.)  Yes, the sextent can be fed.  The submitter can
    provide a better (i.e. well fed) drawing if necessary.  Usage of
    the sextent dates to as early as the 1530's (Copernicus).

Steppes:

    [Device]  We wonder how many commenters will NOT make jokes on the
    blazon.  ...

    The OED says that Tycho Brahe claimed he named it in 1602, though
    the Encyclopedia Britannica (1952 ed.) says that John Hadley
    invented it in 1731.  Serena notes that, for example, the word
    "scrimshaw" is 18th C, but we saw the form at the Assyrian
    exhibit, so the object may predate the current word.

    This charge has not been registered previously in the SCA.  This
    would be the defining instance.  We should be provided with
    documentation that this is a period depiction.

Delphina/Ragnar:

    [Device] This is an excellent drawing of a modern sextant.
    However the sextant was invented in 1731 by John Hadly.  The
    navigation instrument used through our period would have been the
    Astrolabe.  Unless documentation can be provided that this
    instrument was used in period it should to be returned.

Oh, and Blacklake:

    Well designed, period sextent and good placement of blazons.

It was returned at the 10 March 1996 meeting, printed on page 8 of the
April 1996 AG, saying

    "Sable, a sextant Or" is rturned under General Principal 1a of the
    RfS (Compatible Content).

("All submissions shall be period in content.")

Daniel "what, he figured we're gonna forget or something?  wait,
*I* did" de Lincolia
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