ANSTHRLD - submission question (Sla'ine)

Kathleen O'Brien kobrien at bmc.com
Fri Apr 7 10:36:58 PDT 2000


>Name: Sl[a']ine an Mac-Tire was returned for lack of dated references to the 
>names and lack of documentation of the construction.  Also, she had checked 
>"no changes" so the CoH couldn't fix anything, anyway.  
>
>The big problems seem to have been the "an" which means "the" and doesn't 
>seem to belong in that position, the hyphen in Mac-Tire, and the lack of 
>dated reference for the surname.  "Sl[a']ine" can be documented from 
>O'Corrain and MacQuire, p. 166, who call it "common in the later middle
ages" 
>which is probably adequate.  Woulfe, "Irish Names and Surnames" p 318 lists 
>the Gaelic name "Mac an Tsaoir" and the Anglicized version as MacTire, 
>without dates (but his Gaelic names are usually within period.)  Also:
Black, 
>Surnames of Scotland, p 567 under MACTYRE dates Paul MacTyre to 1360, and p 
>519 under MACINTYRE dates Gildow Makintare to 1506 and Duncan M'Kintier to 
>1513.

Depending upon the form the submitter chooses, this name may run afoul of
the "Gaelic feminine names must have their patronymics in a feminine
construction" precedent.  

If I remember correctly, <Sla/ine> is a feminine name.  

Black (p. 519 s.n. MACINTYRE) gives the meaning of the Gaelic <Mac an
t-saoir> as being 'son of the carpenter' or 'wright'.

So the given name is a feminine Gaelic name, the byname is a masculine
patronymic byname.  In period in Gaelic (Irish Gaelic, Scottish Gaelic, or
Manx Gaelic - it doesn't matter), the byname was meant literally.  And
since a woman cannot be anyone's son, the form <Sla/ine Mac an tSaoir> is
not registerable.  

There are several slightly different forms she can choose that are
registerable.  Do you know what's most important to her (sound, meaning,
language/culture, time period, etc.)?  Her preferences will indicate what
direction she should go with this name.  Whether to change it to an
Anglicized form, to change the patronymic particle <Mac> to <ingen>
'daughter' (this is the early spelling, <inghean> is the later spelling),
whether to change the particle to <ingen meic> or <inghean meic>, etc.

>I hope this helps.  Let me know if you need more.  Thanks for your concern 
>and diligence on behalf of your submitters.

I'd like to thank you as well.  It's so helpful to the submitters when
someone is willing to work with them and help them with their submission.
Your help will make it much easier for the submitter to get something
registered that she likes.

Mari, Bordure
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