[ANSTHRLD] conflict check: (Fieldless), in saltire a quill pen and a sword argent

Teceangl tierna at agora.rdrop.com
Wed Aug 22 20:12:43 PDT 2001


> I'm checking (Fieldless) in saltire a quill pen and a sword argent.
>
> (Artistic notes: the sword is actually some fancy type of dagger, as I recall,
> but dagger=sword for conflict purposes, yes?  And the quill actually overlays
> the dagger, but the quill is in bend and the dagger in bend sinister.)

Excellent blazon.

> It looks clear, except for these two:
>
> The more likely conflict: Durvyn Wildermuth von Wiesbaden (October 1998,
> Caid): Vairy Or and azure, in saltire a sword inverted wavy argent, hilted
> gules, and a quill pen argent.
>
> 1 CD for change of field (to fieldless).
> >From here on we're looking at "changes to half the primary charge group"
> CDs.  Bleah.
> - Changing the hilt from gules to argent isn't worth a CD, since that's just
> half of the charge.  (If the entire sword had been gules, then it would be a
> CD, right?).

Hilt isn't even half the charge.  You do get a CD for changing tincture of
half a charge *group*, so if a charge group is a single charge and you change
half the tincture of that charge, it's a CD.  X.4.d.  However, you'd have
to change one entire charge's tincture in this charge group for that CD,
and a hilt doesn't even change half the sword.

> - I doubt the wavy makes a difference, since in a sword that's practically
> artistic license, but am unsure.

You're right, it's not worth difference.  Or...  Let's say I don't think it
is worth difference.  I'm not going to make a definite statement.

> - Inverting the sword MAY make the required CD.

BINGO!  X.4.h. Posture Changes - Significantly changing the posture or
individual orientation of charges in any group placed directly on the field,
including strewn charges or charges overall, is one clear difference. Changing
the posture of at least half of the charges in a group is one clear difference.
One CD for changing the orientation of the sword.

> (Also, is there a difference in saltire between "a pen and a sword" and "a
> sword and a pen"?)

Yes.  First charge is usually bendwise, remember?  You've changed the
orientation of each charge.  Orientation/posture is not cumulative, but
there's a CD for fieldlessness and a CD for posture and you're clear.

> The less possible conflict is Barony of the Middle Marches (November 1983,
> Middle): (Fieldless) In saltire a quill pen argent and a sword inverted proper
> surmounted by a recorder Or.
>
> 1 CD for fieldless, and probably another for removing the recorder.  So this
> is probably clear.

Definitely clear.  Fieldlessness CD plus a CD for removing the third charge
by X.4.f. Number Changes - Significantly changing the number of charges in
any group placed directly on the field or overall is one clear difference.

Note I'm not counting the recorder as a "surmounting" charge, no matter
what the blazon says.  Three charges in that arrangement are in sheaf and
carry equal visual weight, therefore they should be considered a single
charge group.  (The registered badge is slot-machine, but was registered
before we enforced that rule.)

- Teceangl
--
                Don't put all your eggs in one basket.
    Use an egg box like everyone else and stop being such a poser.



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