[ANSTHRLD] badge revision

Hillary Greenslade hillaryrg at yahoo.com
Tue May 8 18:29:42 PDT 2007

> Date: Tue, 8 May 2007 15:43:23 -0500
> From: "HL Chiara Francesca" <vscribe at ansteorra.org>
> Subject: Re: [ANSTHRLD] badge revision
> To: "Heralds List, Kingdom of Ansteorra - SCA,	Inc."
> 	<heralds at lists.ansteorra.org>
> Seems there are three official ones and one unofficial one. (Guilty on the 
> unofficial one, I was asked to create that one about 9 years ago because one 
> of the official ones looks like a butt with a star on it and the ladies 
> found it offensive, the other one is purple and white and no one has any 
> clue how it got passed, and the third is not recognizable as the hands are 
> too many and end up looking like spots of upside down ermine when made into 
> an icon, the one I created is the marching kiddo and it stuck.)
> Someone has emailed my office asking if they can merge the MOC device with 
> their local group device to make a badge. I do not know the rules for that 
> or if they even intend to get it submitted.
> Thank you,
> Chiara
> P.S. How does one go about submitting heraldry for an office in this 
> Kingdom? 

Sorry, this is a bit long....
I'll defer to the submissions Herald for how to register a badge for an officer.  

However, you got me interested looking at the badges for the MoC. 
Regarding the badges for the Ministry of Children, I'm not familiar with the badge you call 'looks
like a butt with a star on it', I don't believe I've seen that one.  

For the one that is 'purple and white', it's possible it was a personal badge used by former MoC
Countess Anora Frayne of Winward, as she and Jean-Rischard had a 'House Purple' household; and it
may have been displayed while she was in office till perhaps an official badge could be
registered.  For some time Anora visited branches and had the children use their handprints to
create a Branch children's banner that she had sewn and then Anora gifted the banner to the branch
to be used as a indication of where children's activities were being held.  It's possible while
she was in office, the badge 'Or semy of hands sable' was created, as it used the handprint design
she used on the banners.  

There are a number of 'children's badges' that are the 'merit' badges as part of the MoC program,
the badge images are found at: http://children.ansteorra.org/badge_art.php
I'm not sure any of these are official registered heraldic badges, but that maybe where some of
the badge confusion comes from. 

According to the online Ordinary and Armorial, the current Kingdom of Ansteorra badges (three)
that refer to children are registered are as follows, and are associated with the 'Kingdom of
1. For the Children's Defender:
The following badge associated with this name was registered in December of 1999 (via Ansteorra):
'Or semy of hands sable, on a lozenge gules a broadsword Or'.
(on occasion a champion of the children is choosen, this is their badge).

2. For the Ministry of Children
The following badge associated with this name was registered in December of 1999 (via Ansteorra):
'Or semy of hands sable'.
(I'm not sure if this if for the kingdom MoC's to use)

3.  Ansteorran Office of the Minister of Children: 
The following badge associated with this name was registered in October of 1987 (via Ansteorra):
'Or, a mullet of five greater and five lesser points sable overall a point issuant from base
(this actually sounds like the Rising Star badge, not an officer badge)

4.  Award of the Compass Rose of Ansteorra:
The following badge associated with this name was registered in December of 1990 (via Ansteorra):
'Per chevron Or and gules, a compass rose sable'.

5. The 'Award of the Rising Star of Ansteorra' name was registered as follows: 
This order name was registered to Ansteorra, Kingdom of in January of 2003 (via Ansteorra).
(My guess is that the name of the 'Rising Star' award was not registerable or some issues to
resolve, so Ansteorra has been using the badge we currently use for the 'Rising Star' and
registered it under the Ansteorran Office of the Minister of Children.)

I confess I'd not seen the badge you created for the MoC, that I find on the website at: 
Whomever asked to create the current badge of a 'marching kiddo' should instead have consulted
with the Star Principal Herald about changing the current MoC badge 'Or semy of hands sable', and
if they had done so 9 years ago, a new badge could have been widely in use by now.  
While your design is delightful, it's sadly unofficial, as you stated.  If it's registerable and
the MoC wants to pursue it, the badge you designed could become official. 

Branches wanting to register a branch badge for the Branch MoC somewhat defeats the purpose of
using a common design, such as Waterbearers or Chirurgeon, for ready recognition of an official
MoC activity, I'd rather suggest they use the kingdom MoC badge, unless or until an SCA-wide badge
is available (which I was not able to find).  

As this discussion may be of some concern to the current Minister of Children, Baroness Adria
Lorelle, I've cc:d her on my post.  

Regards, Hillary

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