[ANSTHRLD] baronial service awards

Jay Rudin rudin at ev1.net
Wed May 9 15:12:15 PDT 2007

Francois responded to Serena:

>> ...  This is
>> another one of those ancient Ansteorran common-law things that
>> everyone used to know,
> ...
>> This practice is part of the body of Ansteorran common law.  (And
>> yeah, I really do mean that in the technical legal sense of the
>> phrase.)
> If only a couple people still remember something how does it remain
> common law?

Obviously, it wouldn't.  Meanwhile, back in Ansteorra, -- a lot more than " 
a couple of people" remember it.  Most active heralds in the Steppes and 
Elfsea area know it.  The twelve ruling nobles it has applied to in those 
areas know it.  I suspect that all active heraldically literate members of 
the Oak know it.  I can't speak to the level of knowledge in other regions.

> Especially since it does not seem to have been the
> practice for a while.

Simply untrue.  A very quick check in the OP, just of the two baronies I 
know best, yields:
Robin and Adelicia had to officially resign membership in the Tread of the 
Steppes (1989)
Arthur and Robyn retain their memberships in the Keystone (1990).
Thorkell and Kalida retain their memberships in the Oak (1993).
Llywelyn and Xene retain their membership in the Keystone (1996).
Catrin retains her membership in the Oak (1999).
Siobhan retains her membership in the Keystone (2002).
Mahdi and Valeria will retain their membership in the Oak (2004).

That's a pretty consistent practice.

> The Society and the Kingdom change for what it
> was and how it worked even 10 years ago. I think some things have
> gotten better and some have gotten worse.  Whether you consider the
> change in this regard as good or bad, a decision needs to be made
> about what to do now.

More important, has this one changed?  The record seems to show that this 
Ansteorran traditional approach is well-remembered and active in some 
places, but not in others.

> In my opinion, it does not matter if membership is automatically given
> because someone takes on the baronial responsiblity or not, it must be
> publicly stated.

It *was* publicly stated -- by the Principal Herald (Aureliane Rioghail) and 
the Crown (Lloyd and Joselyn).  But they knew that they were merely echoing 
the established traditions, that baronies in fief have always carried 
membership in the service orders without explicit mention, just as a Star of 
Merit always carries a Grant of Arms

In 1991, I tried to get it explicitly part of the ceremony.  I tried to 
explicitly give Oaks to my successors, Thorkell and Kalida.  But I lost that 
battle.  Queen Rowan would not waste time on that, since it was automatic 
that they would have it a few minutes later anyway.

I agree with you that the matter should be put in kingdom law today, but 
until the law is officially written, the established principles do in fact 

Robin of Gilwell / Jay Rudin

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